The Flat Earth Society

Flat Earth Discussion Boards => Flat Earth General => Topic started by: Ozymandias74 on March 11, 2019, 08:16:12 PM

Title: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: Ozymandias74 on March 11, 2019, 08:16:12 PM
To anyone that believes the FE model, what convinced you it is correct?
Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: Bullwinkle on March 11, 2019, 08:18:28 PM
It's shape.
Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: SeaCritique on March 11, 2019, 08:40:02 PM
To anyone that believes the FE model, what convinced you it is correct?

Define "FE model:" do you mean the standardly accepted Mono-Pole Model? I'm presuming you just mean that we accept the Earth as being flat instead of round?

Honestly, a good deal of it is trusting my gut. I was raised religiously, trusted my gut on that one, and... I don't believe in any sort of higher powers, supernatural spooks or other ghosties. I was raised to believe that the Earth is round like any other kid, trusted my gut on that one, and... there are some very, very interesting things, odd discrepancies and information that really makes you think, to consider.

It makes sense to me.
Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: rabinoz on March 11, 2019, 10:05:53 PM
It's shape.
I quite like pizzas too (https://www.dropbox.com/s/wzvcckn1sn337xc/pizza16.png?dl=1)but that's hardly a reason.
Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: YogurtStrong on March 12, 2019, 11:53:31 AM
I like to think my teachers aren't right and random people on the internet know what's best
Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: Googleotomy on March 12, 2019, 12:49:21 PM
It's shape.
Is it that you thought the earth was shaped just like the North Polar Azimuthal Equidistant Projection ?
(The one showing Antarctica as the ice ring.)
Some FE's like this one !

Or did you think the earth was shaped just like the Bipolar Projection ?
(The one showing no ice ring but showing Antarctica as a continent. )
Tom Bishop likes this one !

Which one of the above did you think was a map of the flat earth and that convinced  you the earth was flat ?
Or was it some other map or some other reason that convinced you that the flat earth model  is correct ?
Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: Googleotomy on March 12, 2019, 01:07:07 PM
I like to think my teachers aren't right and random people on the internet know what's best

Like your teachers ,  who were '' indoctrinated  '' by teachers and professors who were  '' indoctrinated '' by people in science, engineering , astronomy , geography and other subjects aren't right,  but the only people who believe that the earth is flat know best ?
Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: YogurtStrong on March 12, 2019, 01:09:14 PM
I like to think my teachers aren't right and random people on the internet know what's best
Like your teacher who was '' indoctrinated  '' by teachers and professors who were  '' indoctrinated '' by people in science, engineering , astronomy , geography and other subjects aren't right,  but only people who believe that the earth is flat know best ?

I'm confused by your question here. What are you asking? True? False? Maybe?
Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: Googleotomy on March 12, 2019, 01:17:51 PM
I like to think my teachers aren't right and random people on the internet know what's best
Like your teacher who was '' indoctrinated  '' by teachers and professors who were  '' indoctrinated '' by people in science, engineering , astronomy , geography and other subjects aren't right,  but only people who believe that the earth is flat know best ?

I'm confused by your question here. What are you asking? True? False? Maybe?
My question was ''Which ones do you think 'aren't right' and which ones do you think 'know best' ,'' ?
Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: YogurtStrong on March 12, 2019, 01:26:07 PM
I like to think my teachers aren't right and random people on the internet know what's best
Like your teacher who was '' indoctrinated  '' by teachers and professors who were  '' indoctrinated '' by people in science, engineering , astronomy , geography and other subjects aren't right,  but only people who believe that the earth is flat know best ?

I'm confused by your question here. What are you asking? True? False? Maybe?
My question was ''Which ones do you think 'aren't right' and which ones do you think 'know best' ,'' ?

Between who? What are the options? Teachers vs physicists?
Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: Googleotomy on March 12, 2019, 01:30:56 PM
To anyone that believes the FE model, what convinced you it is correct?

Define "FE model:" do you mean the standardly accepted Mono-Pole Model? I'm presuming you just mean that we accept the Earth as being flat instead of round?

Honestly, a good deal of it is trusting my gut. I was raised religiously, trusted my gut on that one, and... I don't believe in any sort of higher powers, supernatural spooks or other ghosties. I was raised to believe that the Earth is round like any other kid, trusted my gut on that one, and... there are some very, very interesting things, odd discrepancies and information that really makes you think, to consider.

It makes sense to me.

My early school days were much like yours and I just accepted the fact that the earth is round , or was in the shape of the globe.
But when I studied various subjects in college I was more convinced of it.
But when I started working in military service and civilian jobs I observed so many things but then I knew for certain that the earth was shaped like a globe and flat earth certainly didn't make any sense at all.
My apologies , but we people who work in the real world wonder why on earth (no pun intended....LOL) would even think the earth was a flat disc ?
Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: Googleotomy on March 12, 2019, 01:35:08 PM
I like to think my teachers aren't right and random people on the internet know what's best
Like your teacher who was '' indoctrinated  '' by teachers and professors who were  '' indoctrinated '' by people in science, engineering , astronomy , geography and other subjects aren't right,  but only people who believe that the earth is flat know best ?

I'm confused by your question here. What are you asking? True? False? Maybe?
My question was ''Which ones do you think 'aren't right' and which ones do you think 'know best' ,'' ?

Between who? What are the options? Teachers vs physicists?

The options of which I am thinking are :
(1) ''Round Earth'' teachers
(2) ''Flat Earth'' believers
Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: Googleotomy on March 12, 2019, 01:41:36 PM
It's shape.
I quite like pizzas too (https://www.dropbox.com/s/wzvcckn1sn337xc/pizza16.png?dl=1)but that's hardly a reason.

I have a collection of old LPs and new CDs but that is hardly a reason too.
Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: YogurtStrong on March 12, 2019, 01:46:43 PM
I like to think my teachers aren't right and random people on the internet know what's best
Like your teacher who was '' indoctrinated  '' by teachers and professors who were  '' indoctrinated '' by people in science, engineering , astronomy , geography and other subjects aren't right,  but only people who believe that the earth is flat know best ?

I'm confused by your question here. What are you asking? True? False? Maybe?
My question was ''Which ones do you think 'aren't right' and which ones do you think 'know best' ,'' ?

Between who? What are the options? Teachers vs physicists?

The options of which I am thinking are :
(1) ''Round Earth'' teachers
(2) ''Flat Earth'' believers

1? I lost track of the question. As in the round earth people are incorrect. But guess I'm too dumb for this thread
Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: Googleotomy on March 12, 2019, 02:13:51 PM
I like to think my teachers aren't right and random people on the internet know what's best
Like your teacher who was '' indoctrinated  '' by teachers and professors who were  '' indoctrinated '' by people in science, engineering , astronomy , geography and other subjects aren't right,  but only people who believe that the earth is flat know best ?

I'm confused by your question here. What are you asking? True? False? Maybe?
My question was ''Which ones do you think 'aren't right' and which ones do you think 'know best' ,'' ?

Between who? What are the options? Teachers vs physicists?

The options of which I am thinking are :
(1) ''Round Earth'' teachers
(2) ''Flat Earth'' believers

1? I lost track of the question. As in the round earth people are incorrect. But guess I'm too dumb for this thread

Just to put it simply which of the following do you think  is like (but maybe not exactly) the shape of the earth ?
(1) An orange
(2) A pizza
Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: wise on March 12, 2019, 04:08:25 PM
I like to think my teachers aren't right and random people on the internet know what's best

Wellcome. I hope you enjoy here.
Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: Bullwinkle on April 11, 2019, 09:35:02 PM
It's shape.
Is it that you thought the earth was shaped just like the North Polar Azimuthal Equidistant Projection ?
(The one showing Antarctica as the ice ring.)
Some FE's like this one !

Or did you think the earth was shaped just like the Bipolar Projection ?
(The one showing no ice ring but showing Antarctica as a continent. )
Tom Bishop likes this one !

Which one of the above did you think was a map of the flat earth and that convinced  you the earth was flat ?
Or was it some other map or some other reason that convinced you that the flat earth model  is correct ?


Dude, take your stroke medicine.
I have never, ever claimed the Earth is flat.

Is there a chapter in your Navy Manual
about how to yank your head out of your butt?



Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: Lonegranger on April 14, 2019, 01:33:32 AM
It's shape.
Is it that you thought the earth was shaped just like the North Polar Azimuthal Equidistant Projection ?
(The one showing Antarctica as the ice ring.)
Some FE's like this one !

Or did you think the earth was shaped just like the Bipolar Projection ?
(The one showing no ice ring but showing Antarctica as a continent. )
Tom Bishop likes this one !

Which one of the above did you think was a map of the flat earth and that convinced  you the earth was flat ?
Or was it some other map or some other reason that convinced you that the flat earth model  is correct ?


Dude, take your stroke medicine.
I have never, ever claimed the Earth is flat.

Is there a chapter in your Navy Manual
about how to yank your head out of your butt?

If there is, you should go read it.
Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: Stash on April 14, 2019, 01:53:08 AM
It's shape.
Is it that you thought the earth was shaped just like the North Polar Azimuthal Equidistant Projection ?
(The one showing Antarctica as the ice ring.)
Some FE's like this one !

Or did you think the earth was shaped just like the Bipolar Projection ?
(The one showing no ice ring but showing Antarctica as a continent. )
Tom Bishop likes this one !

Which one of the above did you think was a map of the flat earth and that convinced  you the earth was flat ?
Or was it some other map or some other reason that convinced you that the flat earth model  is correct ?


Dude, take your stroke medicine.
I have never, ever claimed the Earth is flat.

Is there a chapter in your Navy Manual
about how to yank your head out of your butt?

If there is, you should go read it.

Moose antlers have two distinct and useful purposes. First, as a means to fend off interloping moose during mating season. Secondly, the lateral shape and width make it impossible for a moose to insert it’s head into his anus or one belonging to another moose for that matter. Therefore a moose’s head can neither be put in nor be in a butt. 
Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: wise on April 15, 2019, 04:22:43 AM
To anyone that believes the FE model, what convinced you it is correct?

God.
Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: Vanyel on April 15, 2019, 05:24:30 AM
To anyone that believes the FE model, what convinced you it is correct?

God.
How?
Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: wise on April 15, 2019, 05:42:57 AM
To anyone that believes the FE model, what convinced you it is correct?

God.
How?

Sorry. the question was what, not how. This question is out of context, it is the issue belonging to religion subforum.
Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: faded mike on April 15, 2019, 11:28:51 PM
There is no curvature apparent over the water. Also globers on here, and debunk vids with water behind the boat that is supposedly partially behind the curve.
Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: Themightykabool on April 16, 2019, 12:42:49 AM
There is no curvature apparent over the water. Also globers on here, and debunk vids with water behind the boat that is supposedly partially behind the curve.

...
i find you very interesting.
what's your theory on life here?
because you haven't said anything yet continue to claim absolute.

Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: rabinoz on April 16, 2019, 02:22:54 AM
There is no curvature apparent over the water. Also globers on here, and debunk vids with water behind the boat that is supposedly partially behind the curve.
Really?



Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: JimmyTheCrab on April 16, 2019, 05:51:38 AM
To anyone that believes the FE model, what convinced you it is correct?
I was in involved in a horrendous yachting accident, where I received a brutal brain injury.  After that, everything started to look a bit flat.  I watched a few youtube videos, and quickly became a flat earther.
Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: faded mike on April 16, 2019, 11:38:18 AM
There is no curvature apparent over the water. Also globers on here, and debunk vids with water behind the boat that is supposedly partially behind the curve.

...
i find you very interesting.
what's your theory on life here?
because you haven't said anything yet continue to claim absolute.
I didn't mean to claim absolute.  What do you mean?
Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: Themightykabool on April 16, 2019, 01:10:28 PM
Its funny how the shoddy "proofs" are good enough for you (faded) but when numbers and evidnec comes into play you can brush it away with a "well who really knows".

Looks flat!
Ok!

Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: faded mike on April 16, 2019, 05:15:53 PM
Sorry, I don't really believe you. Whats your best proof?
Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: rabinoz on April 16, 2019, 06:56:47 PM
I repeat:
There is no curvature apparent over the water. Also globers on here, and debunk vids with water behind the boat that is supposedly partially behind the curve.
What about showing these "vids with water behind the boat that is supposedly partially behind the curve"? How can we comment on what we haven't seen?
Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: Googleotomy on April 16, 2019, 09:03:51 PM
I can think of a lot of things that have convinced me the flat earth model is incorrect.
I can think of a lot of things that have convinced me the  globe is correct.
Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: rabinoz on April 17, 2019, 04:30:46 AM
Sorry, I don't really believe you. Whats your best proof?
Where have you shown any for the flat earth?
Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: Themightykabool on April 17, 2019, 05:30:50 AM
Sorry, I don't really believe you. Whats your best proof?

Title of thread out burden on you.
"Looks flat" was your best?
Good one.

How do you perform at job interview.

Interviewer:  how will you do a good job here at compay and co.
Faded:  it will look like i do.
Interviewer:  thanks for coming out.
Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: Googleotomy on April 17, 2019, 10:10:59 AM
Sorry, I don't really believe you. Whats your best proof?

Title of thread out burden on you.
"Looks flat" was your best?
Good one.

How do you perform at job interview.

Interviewer:  how will you do a good job here at compay and co.
Faded:  it will look like i do.
Interviewer:  thanks for coming out.

How would you perform at an interview with a Navy Recruiter or an Air Force Recruiter ?
Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: Googleotomy on April 17, 2019, 10:23:16 AM
There is no curvature apparent over the water. Also globers on here, and debunk vids with water behind the boat that is supposedly partially behind the curve.

There is a very slight curvature over the water. When you are in the middle of a lake or the ocean, the water is curving away from you , downward from you , in all directions to the horizon. But the curvature is so slight due to the size of the earth that it is not apparent to the eye.
The old ''ship over the horizon'' is a simple debunk of the flat idea.
The ''vids'' are just every day occurrences of ships that have sailed beyond the horizon.
Of course if FE's have always just made their observations from looking out their windows, I have my doubts as to if any FE's have ever been to sea to observe this ?

Here is a simple way to demonstrate this.
Make a scale drawing of a circle - a circle with a circumference of 25,000 miles - the circumference of the globe.
Then with the same scale mark off an arc of about 10 miles - this would be how much would be seen from a lookout in a crow's nest on a ship .
Notice how little curvature there is in that arc of only 10 miles in a circle with a circumference of 25,000 miles.
Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: turtles on April 21, 2019, 08:59:09 AM
To anyone that believes the FE model, what convinced you it is correct?

God.

Which one?
Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: Googleotomy on April 21, 2019, 10:50:57 AM
To anyone that believes the FE model, what convinced you it is correct?

God.

Which one?
At least , if you are a FE, you have a lot of of choices to believe in for the ''FE model'' depending on which choice you pick.
Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: faded mike on June 15, 2019, 08:26:00 PM
There is no curvature apparent over the water. Also globers on here, and debunk vids with water behind the boat that is supposedly partially behind the curve.
Really?
  • What about showing these "vids with water behind the boat that is supposedly partially behind the curve"? How can we comment on what we haven't seen?

  • What is hiding the ships below?
    Quote from: Andy Hall
    CivilWarTalk, The Naval War, "Hull Down" (https://civilwartalk.com/threads/hull-down.83791/)
    If you read much naval history or fiction, especially that takes place in the age of sail, you'll come across the term that another vessel is "hull down." This simply means that the vessel being described is far enough away that the curvature of the earth makes it impossible to see the entire ship above the horizon. If a ship is "hull down," only its masts and maybe a funnel is visible above the horizon; the rest is hidden below (i.e., beyond) the horizon.

    The distance to the horizon depends on the height of the observer, but it's surprisingly short. If you're standing right at the water's edge, with your eye at 5 feet (1.5m) above sea level, the horizon is only about 3 statue miles away, or 2.6 nautical miles (4.8km). At a height of 20 feet (6.1m), about the elevation from which the photos below were taken, the horizon is only about 5.2nm (9.6km) away. At that distance, you could (theoretically) see right to the edge of the other vessel where the hull meets the water. At longer distances, less and less of the hull of the other vessel is visible, until the hull cannot be seen at all. The other vessel is then said to be "hull down."
    . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
    << See the site at CivilWarTalk, The Naval War, "Hull Down" (https://civilwartalk.com/threads/hull-down.83791/) for details of exact where the photos were taken from and the locations of the ships. >>
    So here, then, are the ships that could be seen, shot from an elevation of about 20 feet (6.1m) above sea level, and their calculated distances in nautical miles. I haven't changed the images except to adjust the brightness and contrast levels to reduce the effects of a small amount of residual haze in the atmosphere. Note how the farther ships are indeed partially or fully "hull down" from the point of view of the observer on shore:
    (https://www.dropbox.com/s/uxc06uk57ez7jrw/hull-down-01.jpg?dl=1)

    (https://www.dropbox.com/s/g7ovekkilljnajl/hull-down-02.jpg?dl=1)

    (https://www.dropbox.com/s/9474dkkwudzoxus/hull-down-03.jpg?dl=1)
    What's hiding the farther ships? And is this ship sinking or . . . . .

    Ship `sinks` behind the curvature of Earth or falls off the edge of flat Earth? :) by Smith Zachary
Here's that vid. go to 7:50 and you can see the water behind the boat.

Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: rabinoz on June 15, 2019, 08:57:18 PM
Here's that vid. go to 7:50 and you can see the water behind the boat.

I see your point with that video. It's too blurry to show much but there appears to be some water behind the boat.
The problem with such short distances is that there is so little curve that a few waves in front or behind can mask things.

But I find larger ships at much greater distances much more convincing:
And here we have a huge bulk ore carrier quite visible:
(https://www.dropbox.com/s/pf2vbx9jx9pgext/Flat%20Earth%20Conference%20Debunked%20-%C2%A0Ship%20behind%20horizon%20%231.jpg?dl=1)
         With a similar sized container vessel with the hull hidden behind "something":
(https://www.dropbox.com/s/g6lrrty8ttngd96/Flat%20Earth%20Conference%20Debunked%20-%C2%A0Ship%20behind%20horizon%20%232.jpg?dl=1)
If you want details, the photos were taken on the coast near Wollongong, NSW, and are from this video: Nikon P900 debunks flat earth MCtheEmcee1. (https://www.youtube.co/watch?v=k8zjQt3Tcaw&gl=CO&hl=&app=desktop)
But in my opinion "seeing curvature" over distances like any of these is only a small part if the evidence.

Sunrises, sunsets, moonrises and moonsets  are far better evidence.
Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: faded mike on June 15, 2019, 09:10:58 PM
So waht are your thoughts on this video being circulated as globe evidence? Do you think they noticed the water behind? I think they did not.
Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: rabinoz on June 15, 2019, 11:39:10 PM
So waht are your thoughts on this video being circulated as globe evidence? Do you think they noticed the water behind? I think they did not.
It's not very convincing to me but it does not give significant evidence either way. I put much weight in this sort of observation:
I see and take photos like this:
(https://www.dropbox.com/s/agflgl8bz3xhwfl/LHG-0693%20-%20Sunset%20Karumba%2020070808%2006.25.02%2C%20300%20mm.jpg?dl=1)
LHG-0693 - Sunset Karumba 20070808 06.25.02, 300 mm
       (https://www.dropbox.com/s/y3l9fm2orxrluxn/LHG-0697%20-%20Sunset%20Karumba%2020070808%2006.25.29%2C%20300%20mm.JPG?dl=1)
LHG-0697 - Sunset Karumba 20070808 06.25.29, 300 mm
And I naturally think that the sun is really being hidden behind something, the horizon.
And this:
All those guesses cannot match the simple explanation of the sun's being hidden by the earth and then majestically rising into full view!
(https://www.dropbox.com/s/hnht4c1r5hh4vx1/Sunrise%20-%20Black%20Sea%20HD%2C%20kalcymc%20-%20sun%20part%20risen.jpg?dl=1)
Sunrise - Black Sea HD 265,498 views by kalcymc (https://m.youtube.co/watch?v=XwkdmHt_Ez8&t=112s)
      (https://www.dropbox.com/s/3072agy9hfyi1eb/Sunrise%20Sunsets%20Timelapse%20with%20by%20ZH%20Media%20-%20crop.jpg?dl=1)
HD Video 1080p 4K - Timelapse with Sunrise Sunsets by ZH Media (https://m.youtube.co/watch?v=STAVSfpayJQ)
Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: Tom Bishop on June 15, 2019, 11:42:09 PM
Rab, those pictures are illusions in the Round Earth model. The Round Earth model says that the sun is actually below the horizon in those images. I feel very embarrassed for you that you would continue to post them in support of an argument that there is no illusion occuring.
Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: rabinoz on June 16, 2019, 12:26:12 AM
Rab, those pictures are illusions in the Round Earth model. The Round Earth model says that the sun is actually below the horizon in those images. I feel very embarrassed for you that you would continue to post them in support of an argument that there is no illusion occuring.
Refraction is not "an illusion"! When can you accept that very simple fact? Refraction is real and very thoroughly tested and measured.
Ask any astronomer!

The sun's image in those photos and videos is refracted no more that about 0.5° when the top edge touches the horizon.
You might learn something by reading Understanding Astronomical Refraction (https://aty.sdsu.edu/explain/atmos_refr/understanding.html)

I'd be more embarrassed for you when you are forced to support so many pure hypotheses to make you Earth Model look even faintly possible.
"Bendy light", "a known magnification effect caused by the intense rays of light passing through the strata of the atmolayer" and "The sun is projecting its image upon the thickness of the atmolayer" come to mind.

Do you have any more excuses for your failure to understand the simplicity of the explanations of sunrises and sunsets on the Globe.
And you still don't come near to explaining how perspective cause distanct objects appear smaller but the sun and moon do not appear smaller as they move from overhead towards the horizon.

If you wish to debate these further I suggest that you make a new thread for it not here.
Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: Unconvinced on June 16, 2019, 01:26:34 PM

Refraction is not "an illusion"! When can you accept that very simple fact? Refraction is real and very thoroughly tested and measured.
Ask any astronomer!

Refraction deniers should have their Nikon P900s confiscated by law.  Where would the flat earth movement be without refraction to make camera’s work?
Title: Re: What convinced you the flat earth model is correct?
Post by: Googleotomy on June 16, 2019, 03:57:56 PM
Rab, those pictures are illusions in the Round Earth model. The Round Earth model says that the sun is actually below the horizon in those images. I feel very embarrassed for you that you would continue to post them in support of an argument that there is no illusion occuring.

To Tom Bishop
Those pictures are not illusions,  but are those of what you actually see on an every day basis.
The camera is seeing what your eye is seeing .
Is it that you have never been on a ship in the middle of the ocean or stood on the shore on land and observed the sun setting and disappearing over the horizon ?
But I realize photographs are just one more item on " the FE denial list " when it comes to reality ?
You should be the one to be embarrassed ?