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Other Discussion Boards => Philosophy, Religion & Society => Topic started by: Pezevenk on July 23, 2018, 06:54:50 AM

Title: Consent
Post by: Pezevenk on July 23, 2018, 06:54:50 AM
So there are a few different opinions on what should constitute consent, and I wanted to see the opinions different people have on the subject. Please explain your reasons for having that opinion. I hope I have included all the main options that people usually pick and I'm not leaving anything out.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: DuckDodgers on July 23, 2018, 07:21:04 AM
I think a positive confirmation is needed when it's with a new partner or under stressful situations with a regular partner (such as after a fight), but not needed under normal circumstances with a regular partner. However, if the partner says no, then it should stop regardless of what stage of the encounter it's uttered.

If there is a power dynamic going on, then I lean toward positive consent every time.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Crouton on July 23, 2018, 07:52:28 AM
I think a positive confirmation is needed when it's with a new partner or under stressful situations with a regular partner (such as after a fight), but not needed under normal circumstances with a regular partner. However, if the partner says no, then it should stop regardless of what stage of the encounter it's uttered.

If there is a power dynamic going on, then I lean toward positive consent every time.

Reasonable and well said. I suspect most people share this opinion. Well maybe not people in college. There's some weird things going on there. Or so the news would have me believe. It could almost be completely normal there.

The poll doesn't address the issue with intoxication though. As best as I can figure, 1 person is drunk = any sexual encounter is automatically rape. If both people are drunk then is it double rape or do the rapes cancel out? And if its a double rape. Then does that mean that anyone who jerks off while drunk is raping himself?
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Space Cowgirl on July 23, 2018, 07:57:56 AM
Yeah, DuckDodgers nailed it. I don't know why people think the consent issue is so complicated.

Crouton is also correct, being intoxicated muddies things up. If one person is drunk and the other is not, the one who is not shouldn't try to pressure the drunk one into sex.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Bullwinkle on July 23, 2018, 08:06:14 AM
The problem is some people are too selfish to care about others.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: deadsirius on July 23, 2018, 08:36:49 AM
I like the idea of "constant reaffirmation".

"I would like your consent to thrust again."

"Yes, I consent!"

"Wonderful.  Was that thrust good for you?"

"Yes, I can confirm that as of now, I am satisfied with this sexual encounter."

"Splendid.  May I now thrust again?"

"Yes, I consent to that."

"I'm sorry...could you repeat that but a little more enthusiastically?"

Seriously though...it's not something that really breaks down well into codified rules (beyond the obvious).  Consent is not always enthusiastic--sometimes people just want to have sex even if they're not super excited about who they're doing it with.  Consent (like enthusiasm) is not necessarily verbal.

Everyone wants different things from different sexual encounters--use some common sense and basic empathy in all cases and relax.

"As best as I can figure, 1 person is drunk = any sexual encounter is automatically rape"

That is a bit scary.  I get there are extremes but in general this seems kind of blind to how real people are in the real world.  Not to say this is particularly healthy, but many people want to get drunk and sleep with someone...it's all part and parcel with a lifestyle common to many people in their young adult years
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Crouton on July 23, 2018, 08:44:46 AM
I like the idea of "constant reaffirmation".

"I would like your consent to thrust again."

"Yes, I consent!"

"Wonderful.  Was that thrust good for you?"

"Yes, I can confirm that as of now, I am satisfied with this sexual encounter."

"Splendid.  May I now thrust again?"

"Yes, I consent to that."

"I'm sorry...could you repeat that but a little more enthusiastically?"


Way ahead of you.  I use a pair of two way radios with proper radio etiquette.    Not during the missionary position, that would be ridiculous.  Just during doggy style and reverse cowgirl.  I also give a ten second countdown when I'm close to the "main event".  Okay sometimes I'm off by a few seconds.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Crouton on July 23, 2018, 08:51:28 AM

"As best as I can figure, 1 person is drunk = any sexual encounter is automatically rape"

That is a bit scary.  I get there are extremes but in general this seems kind of blind to how real people are in the real world.  Not to say this is particularly healthy, but many people want to get drunk and sleep with someone...it's all part and parcel with a lifestyle common to many people in their young adult years

I was kind of joking about the college rape situation but I didn't sufficiently clarify it. 

http://time.com/4855492/betsy-devos-candice-jackson-campus-sexual-assault-accusations/

The thing about the discussion of consent is that it's mostly a college age thing.  Adults usually have a pretty clear idea about what crosses the line.  And affirmative constant consent... these people can have fun dying a virgin I guess. 
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: markjo on July 23, 2018, 09:08:53 AM
Is it still rape if she's on top?
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: markjo on July 23, 2018, 09:15:57 AM
Crouton is also correct, being intoxicated muddies things up. If one person is drunk and the other is not, the one who is not shouldn't try to pressure the drunk one into sex.
Then what was the point of getting her drunk in the first place?  :P

But seriously, an intoxicated person isn't legally capable of giving consent to sex.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Crouton on July 23, 2018, 09:24:12 AM
Crouton is also correct, being intoxicated muddies things up. If one person is drunk and the other is not, the one who is not shouldn't try to pressure the drunk one into sex.
Then what was the point of getting her drunk in the first place?  :P

But seriously, an intoxicated person isn't legally capable of giving consent to sex.

It depends on how intoxicated someone is I think.  Maybe a little on if they're experienced at being intoxicated.  If they're so drunk they're passed out then obviously they can't consent.  Other than that, I don't know, being drunk really doesn't alter my attraction to someone.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: DuckDodgers on July 23, 2018, 09:37:46 AM
I feel if you're drunk and initiate sex, it can't be rape no matter how drunk you were. If someone else tries to initiate it with you while you're drunk, they should seek positive affirmation that your drunken self desires sex with them, which could simply be "do you want to sex with me?" Or "are you sure you want to make with the sex?"
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Space Cowgirl on July 23, 2018, 11:11:57 AM
If you find a girl passed out behind a dumpster, don't put your dick in her.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: DuckDodgers on July 23, 2018, 11:20:42 AM
If you find a girl passed out behind a dumpster, don't put your dick in her.
What if a girl finds me passed out behind a dumpster? Can she put her dick in me?
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Space Cowgirl on July 23, 2018, 11:28:47 AM
If you find a girl passed out behind a dumpster, don't put your dick in her.
What if a girl finds me passed out behind a dumpster? Can she put her dick in me?

I think that is allowed.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Pezevenk on July 23, 2018, 11:37:27 AM
Yeah, DuckDodgers nailed it. I don't know why people think the consent issue is so complicated.

Crouton is also correct, being intoxicated muddies things up. If one person is drunk and the other is not, the one who is not shouldn't try to pressure the drunk one into sex.
Yeah, by saying "normal circumstances" I also meant to eliminate circumstances where there's intoxication stuff at play.

I was thinking about the subject because I was conversing with someone on Reddit who thought that unless there was an "enthusiastic yes" that's reaffirmed frequently and unless your partner seems super into it the whole time, it can't be considered consent. Also if it took convincing it's also not consent. All that seemed pretty weird to me and I wanted to see if everyone thinks like that, since my posts questioning her were getting downvoted, and I wanted to see if it's as common an opinion as it seemed.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Bullwinkle on July 23, 2018, 11:41:18 AM
If you pay up front it's not rape.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Space Cowgirl on July 23, 2018, 11:45:37 AM
Yes, it is.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Crouton on July 23, 2018, 11:51:27 AM
Yeah, DuckDodgers nailed it. I don't know why people think the consent issue is so complicated.

Crouton is also correct, being intoxicated muddies things up. If one person is drunk and the other is not, the one who is not shouldn't try to pressure the drunk one into sex.
Yeah, by saying "normal circumstances" I also meant to eliminate circumstances where there's intoxication stuff at play.

I was thinking about the subject because I was conversing with someone on Reddit who thought that unless there was an "enthusiastic yes" that's reaffirmed frequently and unless your partner seems super into it the whole time, it can't be considered consent. Also if it took convincing it's also not consent. All that seemed pretty weird to me and I wanted to see if everyone thinks like that, since my posts questioning her were getting downvoted, and I wanted to see if it's as common an opinion as it seemed.

The whole thing about affirmative consent is that it's really only necessary when someone is so unfamiliar with their partner that they'd need to constantly check to make sure that it's consensual.  But if they were really that uncomfortable and that unsure then it seems that the best thing to do would be to shelf sex until they build more of a relationship.  I mean, constantly having to ask, "hey I'm not raping you am I?" seems like a thoroughly unpleasant sexual encounter.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Pezevenk on July 23, 2018, 11:55:18 AM
Crouton is also correct, being intoxicated muddies things up. If one person is drunk and the other is not, the one who is not shouldn't try to pressure the drunk one into sex.
Then what was the point of getting her drunk in the first place?  :P

But seriously, an intoxicated person isn't legally capable of giving consent to sex.
What happens if both are intoxicated? Stuff gets a bit confusing then (assuming neither were borderline passed out). What stops the other person of claiming they were the ones who were raped instead back at them? They couldn't give consent either. Well I guess it's a question of who "initiated" it, but if both sides expressed willingness to have sex, I don't think it makes that much difference. And the judments of both sides are impaired, so why is the "rapist" held to a higher standard than when sober, when the "victim" is held to a lower standard than when sober? I don't know. It seems a bit weird to me. I'm not doing it anyways, but it seems people do it somewhat frequently without anyone complaining. But I guess the subject of birth control also enters the conversation there, because when people are drunk, they may take risks that they wouldn't otherwise take.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Pezevenk on July 23, 2018, 11:57:24 AM
Yeah, DuckDodgers nailed it. I don't know why people think the consent issue is so complicated.

Crouton is also correct, being intoxicated muddies things up. If one person is drunk and the other is not, the one who is not shouldn't try to pressure the drunk one into sex.
Yeah, by saying "normal circumstances" I also meant to eliminate circumstances where there's intoxication stuff at play.

I was thinking about the subject because I was conversing with someone on Reddit who thought that unless there was an "enthusiastic yes" that's reaffirmed frequently and unless your partner seems super into it the whole time, it can't be considered consent. Also if it took convincing it's also not consent. All that seemed pretty weird to me and I wanted to see if everyone thinks like that, since my posts questioning her were getting downvoted, and I wanted to see if it's as common an opinion as it seemed.

The whole thing about affirmative consent is that it's really only necessary when someone is so unfamiliar with their partner that they'd need to constantly check to make sure that it's consensual.  But if they were really that uncomfortable and that unsure then it seems that the best thing to do would be to shelf sex until they build more of a relationship.  I mean, constantly having to ask, "hey I'm not raping you am I?" seems like a thoroughly unpleasant sexual encounter.
Isn't most people's first time pretty weird and awkward though? I mean, according to her definition, it probably qualifies as rape...
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: DuckDodgers on July 23, 2018, 11:59:56 AM
There is your problem, never trust Reddit with SJW type stuff. In the real world, permission is granted with both words and actions and is maintained until withdrawn. Also, reluctant consent is still consent. If you truly don't want to have sex with someone, then asking multiple times won't change your mind.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Space Cowgirl on July 23, 2018, 12:05:38 PM
If you're trying to be a decent human being and you sense that the consent is reluctant you would stop. If you don't know that the consent was reluctant, then you're not a rapist, it's just unfortunate. The person giving the reluctant consent probably doesn't know how to say no. People are weird.

And, yeah I imagine first time sex is awkward for everyone. If you have to stop and get enthusiastic consent every step of the way it would be even more awkward.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Pezevenk on July 23, 2018, 12:20:35 PM
The person giving the reluctant consent probably doesn't know how to say no.
Oh yeah, that's a thing I've heard many times, and I'm genuinely curious as to why. I know why some inexperienced guys do it (especially little boys, they are told to do something sexual and they just do it because they feel they're supposed to because there's this whole "you're dumb if you refuse sex because you lose something" mentality that some teenagers have), and I guess that applies to a certain extent to teenage girls too. But I would expect that especially for women, this wouldn't be as much of a problem lately.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Space Cowgirl on July 23, 2018, 12:25:10 PM
Girls are trained not to say no, not to stand up for themselves, etc. To be pleasing. If they are afraid to say no it would be because they don't want the guy to not like them. They don't realize that if he doesn't like them for saying no, he didn't like them in the first place.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Pezevenk on July 23, 2018, 12:39:48 PM
Girls are trained not to say no, not to stand up for themselves, etc. To be pleasing. If they are afraid to say no it would be because they don't want the guy to not like them. They don't realize that if he doesn't like them for saying no, he didn't like them in the first place.
Well, yeah, I get that that's a thing that used to happen a lot, but does it still happen that much? From my experience, it seems like the newer generations are a lot more sensitive about those subjects and care a lot more about consent etc.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Space Cowgirl on July 23, 2018, 12:45:19 PM
You out there banging lots of chicks? lol

In about 10 years you will have enough experience to know that you need a lot more experience.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Bullwinkle on July 23, 2018, 12:52:08 PM

From my experience, it seems like the newer generations are a lot more sensitive about those subjects and care a lot more about consent etc.

Can you define 'newer' generations without sounding creepy? 
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Space Cowgirl on July 23, 2018, 12:54:31 PM
I think he's talking about collage sjws, but in the real world women are pressured to make the sex.

Teen Vogue - hey teenage grils, here's how to have anal sex.
Cosmo - put a donut on his dong!
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: markjo on July 23, 2018, 01:13:12 PM
In about 10 years you will have enough experience to know that you need a lot more experience.
Good judgement comes from experience.  Experience comes from bad judgement.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: markjo on July 23, 2018, 01:19:00 PM
Teen Vogue - hey teenage grils, here's how to have anal sex.
Ah, yes.  The poop-hole loop-hole.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Pezevenk on July 23, 2018, 01:29:33 PM
You out there banging lots of chicks? lol
Nope, not what I meant. I meant from conversations I have with people. I'm still a sad virgin  :(
Eh, I don't really care that much. But it's true both for girls and for boys that they're pressured to have sex.

Anyways, it's not just SJWs. People just care a lot more about these things.

Cosmo - put a donut on his dong!
Lol what?

Anyways, these things are actually not mutually exclusive. People are both a lot more weary of consent AND more pressured to have sex.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: DuckDodgers on July 23, 2018, 01:34:00 PM
Guys have always been pressured to have sex or be viewed as less manly. It's a new trend for girls to be pressured to have sex or be viewed as anti-female empowerment, new as in within the last 20 years.

It simply should come down to have sex of you want, don't have sex if you don't want it, just make sure that both parties want to have sex and are comfortable with all activities of said sex.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Space Cowgirl on July 23, 2018, 01:57:11 PM
The weird thing about the pressure on girls is that if they do want to have sex because they like it they're still seen as whores, but if they don't want to have sex for any reason then they are prudes and bitches.

The worst thing about the pressure on girls is that porn has influenced all of it. Now it's not just pressure to have sex, it's pressure to have bad harmful sex.

I don't know how all this has changed the pressure on boys.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: DuckDodgers on July 23, 2018, 02:12:02 PM
The pressure on boys is pretty much the same, have as much sex as possible or else you're a beta cuck. If you're over 18 and still a virgin, you're looked at as either a religious freak or a closet homosexual.

At least that was my experience just over 10 years ago when I was in my late teens/early 20s.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Crouton on July 23, 2018, 02:22:51 PM
The pressure on boys is pretty much the same, have as much sex as possible or else you're a beta cuck. If you're over 18 and still a virgin, you're looked at as either a religious freak or a closet homosexual.

At least that was my experience just over 10 years ago when I was in my late teens/early 20s.

I doubt it's changed all that much.  There just might be some kind of SJW veneer over it.  In most ways I'd say women have it worse.  Except for the prude vs male virgin thing.

You out there banging lots of chicks? lol
Nope, not what I meant. I meant from conversations I have with people. I'm still a sad virgin  :(
Eh, I don't really care that much. But it's true both for girls and for boys that they're pressured to have sex.

Anyways, it's not just SJWs. People just care a lot more about these things.

Cosmo - put a donut on his dong!
Lol what?

Anyways, these things are actually not mutually exclusive. People are both a lot more weary of consent AND more pressured to have sex.

Don't let it get you down.  I used to be a virgin until I had sex.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Pezevenk on July 23, 2018, 02:29:21 PM
Don't let it get you down.  I used to be a virgin until I had sex.
Poor Mary was still a virgin even after she had sex...
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Shifter on July 23, 2018, 03:17:30 PM
(https://rejzor.files.wordpress.com/2015/07/noconsentsex.jpg)

Unfortunately this poster reaffirms that men dont get raped either. What if Jake felt he was taken advantage of and woke up regretting having sex? Not sure how equality works here. This poster really does seem to reaffirm teh stereotype that men are alpha and woman are subservient damsels that need saving.

When both parties are intoxicated it really messes everything up. I mean what level? That you both could barely walk, talk coherently or even open your eyes properly? Or just a little tipsy and 'happy drunk'?

Obviously drugging/spiking is instant rape, even if the victim verbally consented (as some drugs make you far more trusting), but if you both got a little drunk and got overly amorous but one person has the 'morning after regret', Too bad, so sad, not rape

I'm afraid the whole argument of 'consent' has extended to whether or not the woman (never the man) still gives her consent in hindsight the next morning. It's like if she wakes up and changes her mind - you raped her. Or if a woman is simply too scared to say no, apparently the man is still a rapist because men are scary.

We have all heard that 'metoo' story where a woman blasted a celebrity on social media trashing his reputation after an oral encounter despite the fact at the time she was (seemingly) into it.

I think the issue of consent is getting out of hand. Why is a verbal 'yes' even needed in some situations? If you both take each others clothes off and offer no resistance (and indeed help) with penetration, than what the hell is wrong with that?

It's going to get to the point where people need a written contract, signed by a witness to even touch another person (ok, maybe it wont get that far but if it did, I wont be surprised).

Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Bom Tishop on July 23, 2018, 03:34:12 PM
Is it still rape if she's on top?

This is one of the best questions I have seen markjo ask. 

being drunk really doesn't alter my attraction to someone.

Then you have never been drunk before... probably just buzzed.


Oh yeah, that's a thing I've heard many times, and I'm genuinely curious as to why. I know why some inexperienced guys do it (especially little boys, they are told to do something sexual and they just do it because they feel they're supposed to because there's this whole "you're dumb if you refuse sex because you lose something" mentality that some teenagers have), and I guess that applies to a certain extent to teenage girls too. But I would expect that especially for women, this wouldn't be as much of a problem lately.

Then you have little to no experience with women (and some men are like this too)... depending on their upbringing, their past etc...some women are incapable to saying no... however, these same women unfortunately are the least likely to report a rape or abuse.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Space Cowgirl on July 23, 2018, 03:37:40 PM
That is really true, BHS. (the last part)
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Pezevenk on July 23, 2018, 05:01:55 PM
being drunk really doesn't alter my attraction to someone.

Then you have never been drunk before... probably just buzzed.
Hmm, usually alcohol won't make you want to do something you wouldn't think about before. It usually will just make your inhibitions drop very low and impair your judgment and logical thinking. Some people like to pretend alcohol just planted an idea into their mind to justify asshole behavior when it doesn't really usually work that way. Which is not to say that you can't consent to something you definitely wouldn't consent while sober. Just that if you find someone attractive sober, you'll still find them attractive drunk and vise versa. Which isn't really a justification of course, because being attracted to someone doesn't mean you want to have sex with them, and in some cases wanting to have sex with someone may not even mean you're really attracted to them (seen it happen).
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: markjo on July 23, 2018, 05:32:14 PM
(https://rejzor.files.wordpress.com/2015/07/noconsentsex.jpg)

Unfortunately this poster reaffirms that men dont get raped either. What if Jake felt he was taken advantage of and woke up regretting having sex?
Regretting sex is not the same as being raped.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Space Cowgirl on July 23, 2018, 05:40:14 PM
Is that a real poster?
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Shifter on July 23, 2018, 05:41:39 PM
(https://rejzor.files.wordpress.com/2015/07/noconsentsex.jpg)

Unfortunately this poster reaffirms that men dont get raped either. What if Jake felt he was taken advantage of and woke up regretting having sex?
Regretting sex is not the same as being raped.

A female that regrets sex can say she was raped though...

Thanks to the #metoo movement, the term rape has been broadened so that the morning after regret or simply a case of bad sex has the same word applied to someone who was violently raped and lucky to be alive

Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Shifter on July 23, 2018, 05:43:49 PM
Is that a real poster?

I would not be surprised if it was made up, but the message it conveys is unfortunately accurate. I'm sure there are a few liberals who would completely agree with it though
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Space Cowgirl on July 23, 2018, 05:46:57 PM
Some liberals would agree Jake was charged with rape?
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Shifter on July 23, 2018, 06:08:50 PM
Some liberals would agree Jake was charged with rape?

They would agree that he should be charged with rape. (having sex with a woman who apparently cant consent because she was drunk). I'm sure most people would believe the people in the poster are fictitious.

Put it this way. If you and I hit the town together, got drunk and you wake up to see we were both naked in your bed - and being your more rational sober self, could insist I took advantage of you. Even if you couldn't remember, you could fabricate a story that could have police involved and have my career ruined. My being sober or even if I were more drunk than you is irrelevant to the fact that a woman had sex that she later retracted consent
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Space Cowgirl on July 23, 2018, 06:12:29 PM
Yeah, I could do all sorts of things, like stab you while you sleep.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Shifter on July 23, 2018, 06:16:02 PM
Yeah, I could do all sorts of things, like stab you while you sleep.

That is completely acceptable  :o
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Bom Tishop on July 23, 2018, 06:21:33 PM
Some liberals would agree Jake was charged with rape?

They would agree that he should be charged with rape. (having sex with a woman who apparently cant consent because she was drunk). I'm sure most people would believe the people in the poster are fictitious.

Put it this way. If you and I hit the town together, got drunk and you wake up to see we were both naked in your bed - and being your more rational sober self, could insist I took advantage of you. Even if you couldn't remember, you could fabricate a story that could have police involved and have my career ruined. My being sober or even if I were more drunk than you is irrelevant to the fact that a woman had sex that she later retracted consent

This is 100 percent correct unfortunately..it is very sad.

That is why most people who are either rich and or famous will pay off the hussy and make them sign an NDA. Because, unfortunately, these wack job fucked off little losers who started the me too movement and other nonsense have started the witch trials all over again. Completely removed do process....

Just imagine, some little hussy says elon musk raped her....he would immediately be booted from all of his businesses, a public pariah, public enemy number one before the shit even goes to pre trial. The woman could have not even have met Musk, could be thrown out of court for nonsense.... doesn't matter. He will always be Musk the rapist and his life destroyed.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Space Cowgirl on July 23, 2018, 06:29:34 PM
How can he get booted from all his businesses? He didn't even get booted when he called the Thai cave rescuer dude a pedo.

Also, are you saying you think Harvey Weinstein was innocent?
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: DuckDodgers on July 23, 2018, 06:39:06 PM
Is that a real poster?

I would not be surprised if it was made up, but the message it conveys is unfortunately accurate. I'm sure there are a few liberals who would completely agree with it though
Isn't this the definition of a straw man argument? You built this liberal argument from a most likely fake poster, then ranted about the liberals having this position. I haven't heard of a case of rape being reported where both parties were drunk, have you?
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: markjo on July 23, 2018, 06:50:43 PM
Is that a real poster?
Apparently yes.
https://www.dailydot.com/irl/anti-rape-poster-reddit-conversations/
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: disputeone on July 23, 2018, 06:54:47 PM
Or so the news would have me believe.

Lol, quite easily too they just tell you and you believe it word for word.

Were you one of the 5k viewers of Anderson (CIA spook) cooper.

No wonder you guys are losing the information war. Your main propaganda mouthpiece who started his career in the CIA only gets 5k viewers on a live stream.
Why do you hate honest youtubers pulling millions of views per video again?

Lol never mind.

Hi frens. :).
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: disputeone on July 23, 2018, 06:59:02 PM
You out there banging lots of chicks? lol
Nope, not what I meant. I meant from conversations I have with people. I'm still a sad virgin  :(

You denied it when I called you out on it. Stop being a soyboy beta male.

PM me and we'll talk. I was raised by a single mother too.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Shifter on July 23, 2018, 07:00:11 PM
Is that a real poster?

I would not be surprised if it was made up, but the message it conveys is unfortunately accurate. I'm sure there are a few liberals who would completely agree with it though
Isn't this the definition of a straw man argument? You built this liberal argument from a most likely fake poster, then ranted about the liberals having this position. I haven't heard of a case of rape being reported where both parties were drunk, have you?

An aspiring cadet who will probably have his career forever tainted by some womans 'morning after regret' even though he was cleared of all charges and wrong doing. Of course some liberal snowflakes will still be outraged and say justice was not served

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-07-05/adfa-cadet-found-not-guilty-of-rape/8680872

Title: Re: Consent
Post by: DuckDodgers on July 23, 2018, 08:23:22 PM
Is that a real poster?

I would not be surprised if it was made up, but the message it conveys is unfortunately accurate. I'm sure there are a few liberals who would completely agree with it though
Isn't this the definition of a straw man argument? You built this liberal argument from a most likely fake poster, then ranted about the liberals having this position. I haven't heard of a case of rape being reported where both parties were drunk, have you?

An aspiring cadet who will probably have his career forever tainted by some womans 'morning after regret' even though he was cleared of all charges and wrong doing. Of course some liberal snowflakes will still be outraged and say justice was not served

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-07-05/adfa-cadet-found-not-guilty-of-rape/8680872
I retract my accusation of it being a strawman as the poster apparently was real, though very limited and from a decade ago. However, your link does not describe a case of both parties drunk and the male being accused of rape.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: disputeone on July 23, 2018, 08:47:07 PM
Oh Duck there are hundreds of examples of a male being done for rape when both parties are equally inebriated. Come on now.

It isn't equality. It puts far more responsibility on the male in the encounter.

It's feminism.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: disputeone on July 23, 2018, 08:52:23 PM
Srs question for the bleeding hearts here. (Duck)

I was woken up in a very pleasant way by a very nice girl on the weekend. I was asleep so I obviously couldn't consent in the strictest sense.

Was I raped?
Srlsy???

If I reported this as a rape would I be taken seriously or laughed out the door?
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Shifter on July 23, 2018, 09:08:26 PM
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/08/05/us/usc-rape-case-dropped-video-evidence.html

Here is some

If you are drunk, consent to sex, wake up and regret it you can call the cops. Even if you don't get a conviction, the damage to the other persons reputation will be done. The woman wont be charged with making a false claim but the guy may have his personal life, career and prospects destroyed. As the law stands now that is very possible. Most of these kinds of cases are a he said/she said affair and tell me, is anyone going to take the word of the man (accused of rape) over the woman? Whose words carry more weight?

If I am drunk and lose all my money gambling in a Casino, can I come in the next day and get my money back? Could I argue the Casino breached their duty of care and allowed me to gamble inebriated and thus I took risks and consented to things I would not have done ordinarily? I doubt it. They serve the damn drinks probably for this very reason! But with sex, you can get drunk, flirt with people, rip their clothes off and demand they fuck you up and when you wake up can have them charged with rape (or if they are very wealthy can blackmail them for a NDA)
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: DuckDodgers on July 24, 2018, 06:35:27 AM
Srs question for the bleeding hearts here. (Duck)

I was woken up in a very pleasant way by a very nice girl on the weekend. I was asleep so I obviously couldn't consent in the strictest sense.

Was I raped?
Srlsy???

If I reported this as a rape would I be taken seriously or laughed out the door?
I don't know what thread you've been reading, but I'm far from a bleeding heart.
For your situation, if you've never had sex with the woman before, yes it could be considered rape and you shouldn't be laughed at for reporting it as such. If you and the woman had made with the sex before, particularly the night before, then it's only rape if you tell her to stop and she doesn't. It's really simple.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/08/05/us/usc-rape-case-dropped-video-evidence.html

Here is some

If you are drunk, consent to sex, wake up and regret it you can call the cops. Even if you don't get a conviction, the damage to the other persons reputation will be done. The woman wont be charged with making a false claim but the guy may have his personal life, career and prospects destroyed. As the law stands now that is very possible. Most of these kinds of cases are a he said/she said affair and tell me, is anyone going to take the word of the man (accused of rape) over the woman? Whose words carry more weight?

If I am drunk and lose all my money gambling in a Casino, can I come in the next day and get my money back? Could I argue the Casino breached their duty of care and allowed me to gamble inebriated and thus I took risks and consented to things I would not have done ordinarily? I doubt it. They serve the damn drinks probably for this very reason! But with sex, you can get drunk, flirt with people, rip their clothes off and demand they fuck you up and when you wake up can have them charged with rape (or if they are very wealthy can blackmail them for a NDA)
Being accused and being convicted are 2 different things. I agree an accusation can be incredibly damaging and I hope women are taking their power of accusation seriously. But you can recover from an accusation a lot more easily than a conviction. Even without the current atmosphere, a woman can accuse a man of rape after any sexual encounter, that will never change, but the man likely won't be convicted.

Moral of the story, just make sure she wants you to put your dick in her before you do so.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Pezevenk on July 24, 2018, 03:13:30 PM
You denied it when I called you out on it. Stop being a soyboy beta male.
No I did not. I never did. I may have said I don't understand what that has to do with anything, or said that it's not my main problem, or something. But I'm 100% certain I did not deny that.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Shifter on July 24, 2018, 03:19:29 PM
Moral of the story, just make sure she wants you to put your dick in her before you do so.

No. The moral of the story is to protect yourself by making sure there is written (or better yet) video evidence of her granting you her explicit and enthusiastic consent. Even then, if the sex is bad and she changes her mind after the deed, she is still within her rights to destroy you on social media with a hashtag of #metoo.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: DuckDodgers on July 24, 2018, 06:45:40 PM
Obviously she shouldn't, but yes, she is within her rights to go onto social media and destroy you.  As you are within your rights to attempt to do the same.  I'm sorry society doesn't equally trust men and women when it comes to sexual assault, violence, and/or rape.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Space Cowgirl on July 24, 2018, 06:48:38 PM
I can't imagine why that is https://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/law-order/true-crime-scene/canadian-colonel-russell-williams-depraved-development-from-wearing-womens-underwear-to-murder/news-story/aa82052d06bc7668ce3de1d5e9543d5b
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: disputeone on July 25, 2018, 02:34:37 AM
You denied it when I called you out on it. Stop being a soyboy beta male.
No I did not. I never did. I may have said I don't understand what that has to do with anything, or said that it's not my main problem, or something. But I'm 100% certain I did not deny that.

Very well. I made a lot of assumptions about you in a post and you dismissed all of them. You probably didn't outright deny it.

It's so much more common than you think you're not the only guy who struggles. I'm assuming your in your early 20s. I think the stats are around in in 5 males your age are in a similar situation. Don't let people call you an incel, you're just a genuinely nice guy. (that's half your problem.)

Still, I'd like you to PM me so we can talk. I could help you out with your wamman problems. I'd like to, too many men don't have other men to talk so and seek advice from so I always offer.

Up to you.
I missed you DNO you're one of my favorite posters. Sorry if I have been rude to you this site tries my patience.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Pezevenk on July 25, 2018, 02:49:12 AM
You denied it when I called you out on it. Stop being a soyboy beta male.
No I did not. I never did. I may have said I don't understand what that has to do with anything, or said that it's not my main problem, or something. But I'm 100% certain I did not deny that.

Very well. I made a lot of assumptions about you in a post and you dismissed all of them. You probably didn't outright deny it.
Oh, I remember. I didn't dismiss them all. Some were true, I dismissed the post as a whole.

Quote
It's so much more common than you think you're not the only guy who struggles.
I know that and I don't "struggle". It wasn't my main issue back then and it's not my main issue now. I don't consider myself an "incel".

Quote
Still, I'd like you to PM me so we can talk. I could help you out with your wamman problems. I'd like to, too many men don't have other men to talk so and seek advice from so I always offer.
Well maybe not right now because I'm on vacation. Thanks for the offer though.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: disputeone on July 25, 2018, 03:04:26 AM
Sure no problems. The MSM considers you an incel and would like to shame you for it. I think it's an awful thing to do to disaffected men.

I only meant struggle as in struggles with waman, I've said it before you are clearly intelligent
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: disputeone on July 25, 2018, 03:29:51 AM
if you've never had sex with the woman before, yes it could be considered rape and you shouldn't be laughed at for reporting it as such. If you and the woman had made with the sex before, particularly the night before

So, for a waman, consent lasts for 12-24 hours, got it.

How long does consent for men last?

Is it also 12-24 hours?
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Pezevenk on July 25, 2018, 06:17:42 AM
Sure no problems. The MSM considers you an incel and would like to shame you for it.
No one I know calls people incels, but some people are definitely shamed for being virgins, but mostly from their peers. I don't usually see it on MSM.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: DuckDodgers on July 25, 2018, 06:19:47 AM
if you've never had sex with the woman before, yes it could be considered rape and you shouldn't be laughed at for reporting it as such. If you and the woman had made with the sex before, particularly the night before

So, for a waman, consent lasts for 12-24 hours, got it.

How long does consent for men last?

Is it also 12-24 hours?
I honestly don't see how you get that out of what you quoted or anything else I've said in this thread. Please at least try to be genuine with your discussions.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Space Cowgirl on July 25, 2018, 07:14:20 AM
if you've never had sex with the woman before, yes it could be considered rape and you shouldn't be laughed at for reporting it as such. If you and the woman had made with the sex before, particularly the night before

So, for a waman, consent lasts for 12-24 hours, got it.

How long does consent for men last?

Is it also 12-24 hours?
I honestly don't see how you get that out of what you quoted or anything else I've said in this thread. Please at least try to be genuine with your discussions.

He is incapable of being genuine.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: DuckDodgers on July 25, 2018, 09:06:52 AM
Sure no problems. The MSM considers you an incel and would like to shame you for it.
No one I know calls people incels, but some people are definitely shamed for being virgins, but mostly from their peers. I don't usually see it on MSM.
I'm sure you realize it's also possible to not measure your masculinity by sexual conquests.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Pezevenk on July 25, 2018, 11:19:06 AM
Sure no problems. The MSM considers you an incel and would like to shame you for it.
No one I know calls people incels, but some people are definitely shamed for being virgins, but mostly from their peers. I don't usually see it on MSM.
I'm sure you realize it's also possible to not measure your masculinity by sexual conquests.
I'm not sure why you're addressing that to me...
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Space Cowgirl on July 25, 2018, 11:21:49 AM
I think he was saying for D1 and not you.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: DuckDodgers on July 25, 2018, 11:29:24 AM
I was directly quoting you but saying it more for D1's sake because of his offer to help you with women and his insinuating that you're a nice guy and that's a problem.

I was also trying to give you support in opposition to his position that sexual experience gives you man power.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: boydster on July 25, 2018, 12:28:04 PM
From the safe cover of his keyboard and computer monitor, D1 is an alpha male warrior who makes frequently with the sex and beats up soyboys but also has mad respect for women and would never bully people except if they forget to expect his internet friends, who are going to hack the bad guys to teach them a lesson about 9/11 and the grassy knoll.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Definitely Not Swedish on July 25, 2018, 12:54:20 PM
So there are a few different opinions on what should constitute consent, and I wanted to see the opinions different people have on the subject. Please explain your reasons for having that opinion. I hope I have included all the main options that people usually pick and I'm not leaving anything out.
I didn't read any of the quoted stuff above nor the pages befote this.

Anyway, your poll is utter bullshit.
It's very simple. An explicit spoken 'yes' is obviously not always necessary. It's about body language and what she says/ does. How can people make something that simple so hard?
She goes with the flow - thats a yes.
She doesn't and/or 'pushes you back' and/or says no - well, that fucking obviously is a no.
If, for some reason, your not sure, just ask. Very simple.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Pezevenk on July 25, 2018, 01:29:53 PM
So there are a few different opinions on what should constitute consent, and I wanted to see the opinions different people have on the subject. Please explain your reasons for having that opinion. I hope I have included all the main options that people usually pick and I'm not leaving anything out.
I didn't read any of the quoted stuff above nor the pages befote this.

Anyway, your poll is utter bullshit.
It's very simple. An explicit spoken 'yes' is obviously not always necessary. It's about body language and what she says/ does. How can people make something that simple so hard?
She goes with the flow - thats a yes.
She doesn't and/or 'pushes you back' and/or says no - well, that fucking obviously is a no.
If, for some reason, your not sure, just ask. Very simple.
Well, if you read the rest you'll see some people don't think it's that simple.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Shifter on July 25, 2018, 02:17:46 PM
So there are a few different opinions on what should constitute consent, and I wanted to see the opinions different people have on the subject. Please explain your reasons for having that opinion. I hope I have included all the main options that people usually pick and I'm not leaving anything out.
I didn't read any of the quoted stuff above nor the pages befote this.

Anyway, your poll is utter bullshit.
It's very simple. An explicit spoken 'yes' is obviously not always necessary. It's about body language and what she says/ does. How can people make something that simple so hard?
She goes with the flow - thats a yes.
She doesn't and/or 'pushes you back' and/or says no - well, that fucking obviously is a no.
If, for some reason, your not sure, just ask. Very simple.
Well, if you read the rest you'll see some people don't think it's that simple.

Then some people are retarted. Sorry, but all this explicit, enthusiastic, to the point of almost getting written and visually recorded consent really takes away and kills the romance. "Oh? You had a drink of champaigne? Sorry, We'll have to hook up again when the alcohol is out of your system. Legally, you aren't in a position to consent to sexual relations or touching of any kind"

If one thing 'leads to another" and both parties do not offer any resistance, than what is wrong with what happens?

What should be taught is not so much a requirement to say 'yes', but saying 'NO'. If you don't want it, than speak up. Don't flirt and fondle a guys balls and then bitch about being 'raped' because you ended up having sex but you didn't do anything to stop him going further either.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Pezevenk on July 25, 2018, 05:41:06 PM
Well the alcohol thing is mostly so that people aren't going to get other people drunk to make them consent. I can understand it up to a point.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Shifter on July 25, 2018, 05:55:23 PM
Well the alcohol thing is mostly so that people aren't going to get other people drunk to make them consent. I can understand it up to a point.

Woman chooses to go out, have a good time, have a few drinks

Society tells her she can no longer consent for sex she may want because of said drinks

Why is society dictating to a woman whether or not she wants or should have sex or not?
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: DuckDodgers on July 25, 2018, 08:56:37 PM
Well the alcohol thing is mostly so that people aren't going to get other people drunk to make them consent. I can understand it up to a point.

Woman chooses to go out, have a good time, have a few drinks

Society tells her she can no longer consent for sex she may want because of said drinks

Why is society dictating to a woman whether or not she wants or should have sex or not?
Because of asshole guys who put their dicks inside of women who have drank so much they pass out.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Shifter on July 25, 2018, 09:08:56 PM
Well the alcohol thing is mostly so that people aren't going to get other people drunk to make them consent. I can understand it up to a point.

Woman chooses to go out, have a good time, have a few drinks

Society tells her she can no longer consent for sex she may want because of said drinks

Why is society dictating to a woman whether or not she wants or should have sex or not?
Because of asshole guys who put their dicks inside of women who have drank so much they pass out.

Thats not the same as a woman who only got a little tipsy by choice and wants to engage in sexual relations with some random. She should be free if thats what she wants. However at the same time, one is resposible for their choices. You cant complain the next day that what you chose to get up to is someone elses fault. If I got drunk and lost money to a casino, I cant get my money back. It was a poor choice on my part and I have to accept the consequences

We are essentially trying to have a system where you cant touch a women if they don't consent (which is fair enough of course). But if they have had any alcohol to drink, they cant legally consent. But at the same time, if they do end up having sex, it's ALL the males fault and its now a matter of rape if the woman wakes up with regret. We are not allowed to chastise the woman for her poor choices (victim blaming) and we free her from the burden of responsibility of those choices.

Despite the fact that she could have been fully conscious and initiated the flirting, leading and engagement for sex (Shock horror!  :o A woman that's into having sex!), the male could have his career destroyed because she wakes up and 'changes her mind' in retrospect (must be that male privilege we are so used to hearing about).

Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Definitely Not Swedish on July 25, 2018, 11:18:10 PM
If the man is more drunk than the women, did the man get raped?
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Pezevenk on July 26, 2018, 12:45:22 AM
I think it should depend on how drunk you are really. But it's kinda hard to gauge I guess.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: DuckDodgers on July 26, 2018, 06:24:34 AM
Well the alcohol thing is mostly so that people aren't going to get other people drunk to make them consent. I can understand it up to a point.

Woman chooses to go out, have a good time, have a few drinks

Society tells her she can no longer consent for sex she may want because of said drinks

Why is society dictating to a woman whether or not she wants or should have sex or not?
Because of asshole guys who put their dicks inside of women who have drank so much they pass out.

Thats not the same as a woman who only got a little tipsy by choice and wants to engage in sexual relations with some random. She should be free if thats what she wants. However at the same time, one is resposible for their choices. You cant complain the next day that what you chose to get up to is someone elses fault. If I got drunk and lost money to a casino, I cant get my money back. It was a poor choice on my part and I have to accept the consequences

We are essentially trying to have a system where you cant touch a women if they don't consent (which is fair enough of course). But if they have had any alcohol to drink, they cant legally consent. But at the same time, if they do end up having sex, it's ALL the males fault and its now a matter of rape if the woman wakes up with regret. We are not allowed to chastise the woman for her poor choices (victim blaming) and we free her from the burden of responsibility of those choices.

Despite the fact that she could have been fully conscious and initiated the flirting, leading and engagement for sex (Shock horror!  :o A woman that's into having sex!), the male could have his career destroyed because she wakes up and 'changes her mind' in retrospect (must be that male privilege we are so used to hearing about).
A woman who goes out with the intention of getting some strange is the same woman who will not report a rape the next day. The idea behind not being able to consent due to alcohol is meant to protect women from predatory men, not limit their ability to prowl for some dick. It's not like police are going to barge in to his or her place and arrest the man mid thrust because she has some alcohol in her system.

And I can't stress this enough, women have been able to make rape accusations the following day for a long time, it's just been largely ignored along with other claims of rape. No law is going to prevent a woman's ability to make claims of rape the following day. I also doubt the after-the-fact withdrawal of consent is a majority problem.

I again come back to, if it's a new partner, make sure you get positive consent. If she is obviously drunk, maybe considering skipping this chance to make with the sex. If she is passed out, be a gentleman and make sure she gets home safe without putting your dick in her.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Jura-Glenlivet II on July 26, 2018, 07:32:07 AM

I dream of a world where two people who get a bit pissed and end up making a mistake, admit that, and move on rather than one becoming a victim and the other a criminal, itís only sex.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Definitely Not Swedish on July 26, 2018, 07:36:10 AM
itís only sex.
Lol
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: disputeone on July 28, 2018, 04:55:18 AM
if you've never had sex with the woman before, yes it could be considered rape and you shouldn't be laughed at for reporting it as such. If you and the woman had made with the sex before, particularly the night before

So, for a waman, consent lasts for 12-24 hours, got it.

How long does consent for men last?

Is it also 12-24 hours?
I honestly don't see how you get that out of what you quoted or anything else I've said in this thread. Please at least try to be genuine with your discussions.

Because you said that sex the night before implied consent the next morning for the waman.
I was wondering if this was the same for the man.

Feel free not to answer.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: disputeone on July 28, 2018, 04:56:06 AM
it’s only sex.
Lol

BEGONE
E
G
O
N
E
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: DuckDodgers on July 28, 2018, 05:11:34 AM
if you've never had sex with the woman before, yes it could be considered rape and you shouldn't be laughed at for reporting it as such. If you and the woman had made with the sex before, particularly the night before

So, for a waman, consent lasts for 12-24 hours, got it.

How long does consent for men last?

Is it also 12-24 hours?
I honestly don't see how you get that out of what you quoted or anything else I've said in this thread. Please at least try to be genuine with your discussions.

Because you said that sex the night before implied consent the next morning for the waman.
I was wondering if this was the same for the man.

Feel free not to answer.
You left out the last part of my quote which clearly answers your question. Seriously, can you not be honest when you have discussions?
Srs question for the bleeding hearts here. (Duck)

I was woken up in a very pleasant way by a very nice girl on the weekend. I was asleep so I obviously couldn't consent in the strictest sense.

Was I raped?
Srlsy???

If I reported this as a rape would I be taken seriously or laughed out the door?
I don't know what thread you've been reading, but I'm far from a bleeding heart.
For your situation, if you've never had sex with the woman before, yes it could be considered rape and you shouldn't be laughed at for reporting it as such. If you and the woman had made with the sex before, particularly the night before, then it's only rape if you tell her to stop and she doesn't.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: disputeone on July 28, 2018, 05:19:19 AM
The situation I described the male was initially asleep and unable to give consent.

Was it rape?

Sorry but who's being dishonest?
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Pezevenk on July 28, 2018, 05:23:30 AM
I'm a bit confused, how did she have sex with him while he was asleep?
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: disputeone on July 28, 2018, 05:24:29 AM
Never been woken up with a bj hey?
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: DuckDodgers on July 28, 2018, 05:25:40 AM
The situation I described the male was initially asleep and unable to give consent.

Was it rape?

Sorry but who's being dishonest?
Try reading my response again. I clearly answered your question.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Pezevenk on July 28, 2018, 05:33:32 AM
Never been woken up with a bj hey?
But... then you've waken up... You're not asleep... You can say if it bothers you.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: disputeone on July 28, 2018, 05:42:50 AM
The situation I described the male was initially asleep and unable to give consent.

Was it rape?

Sorry but who's being dishonest?
Try reading my response again. I clearly answered your question.

Sure you did.

Never been woken up with a bj hey?
But... then you've waken up... You're not asleep... You can say if it bothers you.

That's true, I'm just trying to point out the double standard that if a male did that to a female it would be considered sexual assault / rape. If a female did that to a male it's fine because, well.

(https://s22.postimg.cc/xb532i7m9/820.jpg)

While I agree with the meme, we never have a conversation about the double standard.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Pezevenk on July 28, 2018, 05:57:23 AM
That's true, I'm just trying to point out the double standard that if a male did that to a female it would be considered sexual assault / rape.
I'm not sure it would be considered sexual assault if they slept together that last night (depending on what it was, if penetration was involved that's different). If they hadn't it's a different story. I mean, if some random girl I shared a room with or something just came and started sucking my dick while I was asleep I'd be kinda creeped out too. And I'm actually fine with men in general having a bit more responsibility about those matters, because they are in general a bit more intimidating, and they can get more aggressive sexually, simply because of physical differences and how sex works for either party.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: disputeone on July 28, 2018, 06:01:01 AM
That's true, I'm just trying to point out the double standard that if a male did that to a female it would be considered sexual assault / rape.
I'm not sure it would be considered sexual assault if they slept together that last night (depending on what it was, if penetration was involved that's different). If they hadn't it's a different story. I mean, if some random girl I shared a room with or something just came and started sucking my dick while I was asleep I'd be kinda creeped out too. And I'm actually fine with men in general having a bit more responsibility about those matters, because they are in general a bit more intimidating, and they can get more aggressive sexually, simply because of physical differences and how sex works for either party.

I agree, men and women are different. Yet we can't treat men and women differently it's 2018, yet women need to have more protections against sexual assault, women get lesser sentances for comparable violent crimes etc.

Again I'm pointing out the double standard of modern feminism and their idea of "rape culture."
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Pezevenk on July 28, 2018, 06:16:21 AM
I agree, men and women are different. Yet we can't treat men and women differently it's 2018, yet women need to have more protections against sexual assault, women get lesser sentances for comparable violent crimes etc.

You should treat them differently in matters directly pertaining to their physical differences, that makes sense. And I think it also makes sense to have more protection for women against sexual assault, given that they're overwhelmingly more likely to be victims of sexaul assault. But I also think there should be more consideration for male victims of sexual assault than there is now.

Quote
Again I'm pointing out the double standard of modern feminism and their idea of "rape culture."
What does any of this have to do with rape culture?
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: paradoor on July 28, 2018, 06:18:19 AM
Well, none of these poll options really agree with me. Personally, I think you can ask for consent without going "do you want to do this?". For instance, you can suggest doing something and see how that person responds; they could say "not now" or they could be into it and respond earnestly. That, for me, counts as a consent. And consent can be taken back at any time, and there should always be a way for all involved parties to retract their consent at any time (eg safewords, safe gestures like snapping your fingers, etc).
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Pezevenk on July 28, 2018, 06:23:03 AM
Well, none of these poll options really agree with me. Personally, I think you can ask for consent without going "do you want to do this?". For instance, you can suggest doing something and see how that person responds; they could say "not now" or they could be into it and respond earnestly. That, for me, counts as a consent. And consent can be taken back at any time, and there should always be a way for all involved parties to retract their consent at any time (eg safewords, safe gestures like snapping your fingers, etc).
By "yes" and "no" I don't necessarily mean actually saying these words in particular. "Not now" for example would be a "no".
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: disputeone on July 28, 2018, 06:35:58 AM
I agree, men and women are different. Yet we can't treat men and women differently it's 2018, yet women need to have more protections against sexual assault, women get lesser sentances for comparable violent crimes etc.

You should treat them differently

#

Quote
Again I'm pointing out the double standard of modern feminism and their idea of "rape culture."
What does any of this have to do with rape culture?

Rape, that the definition of rape and sexual assault is different for men and women, also the double standard.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: disputeone on July 28, 2018, 06:39:44 AM
there should always be a way for all involved parties to retract their consent at any time (eg safewords, safe gestures like snapping your fingers, etc).

Dude what the f*ck are you into, keep it on the nsfw boards please lmao.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Pezevenk on July 28, 2018, 06:40:56 AM
Quote
Again I'm pointing out the double standard of modern feminism and their idea of "rape culture."
What does any of this have to do with rape culture?

Rape, that the definition of rape and sexual assault is different for men and women, also the double standard.
Again, what do you think this says about the concept of rape culture?
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: disputeone on July 28, 2018, 06:44:55 AM
Quote
Again I'm pointing out the double standard of modern feminism and their idea of "rape culture."
What does any of this have to do with rape culture?

Rape, that the definition of rape and sexual assault is different for men and women, also the double standard.
Again, what do you think this says about the concept of rape culture?

Sometimes I forget I'm dealing with normies and how you need everything fed to you.

Here comes the aeroplane.

"What does rape have to do with rape culture."

Getting past the obvious stupidity of that question...
When the definitions of rape for men and women are different and then used to justify calling the culture in western nations a "rape culture"
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Ichimaru Gin :] on July 28, 2018, 06:49:41 AM
Save your text messages. They have saved numerous men from women with a regret=rape mindset.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Pezevenk on July 28, 2018, 07:25:58 AM
Quote
Again I'm pointing out the double standard of modern feminism and their idea of "rape culture."
What does any of this have to do with rape culture?

Rape, that the definition of rape and sexual assault is different for men and women, also the double standard.
Again, what do you think this says about the concept of rape culture?

Sometimes I forget I'm dealing with normies and how you need everything fed to you.

Maybe you could just answer why you think that refutes rape culture or something instead of just throwing that there.

Quote
When the definitions of rape for men and women are different and then used to justify calling the culture in western nations a "rape culture"
What? How? Maybe you just don't understand what "rape culture" means.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Definitely Not Swedish on July 28, 2018, 07:54:55 AM
Quote
Rape, that the definition of rape and sexual assault is different for men and women, also the double standard.
While I agree the definition is stupid, the punishment for 'rape of men' (I think it's just called sexual assault in law) and rape of women are usually the same, so it doesn't really matter.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Pezevenk on July 28, 2018, 12:00:00 PM
No, I'm pretty sure rape of men is legally recognized. It's either when they're penetrated by other men or forced to penetrate a woman.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Definitely Not Swedish on July 28, 2018, 12:34:20 PM
No, I'm pretty sure rape of men is legally recognized. It's either when they're penetrated by other men or forced to penetrate a woman.
Depends on the country.
In my country, rape is defined in a way it legally can only happen to women. I think in the US it's the same.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: boydster on July 28, 2018, 12:41:41 PM
I'm no expert, but it seems like that might not be the case? It seems it's pretty clearly defined that it can happen to both men and women.

(https://preview.ibb.co/cB0HYo/Capture.png)
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Pezevenk on July 28, 2018, 01:35:09 PM
I'm no expert, but it seems like that might not be the case? It seems it's pretty clearly defined that it can happen to both men and women.

(https://preview.ibb.co/cB0HYo/Capture.png)
But he's definitely not Swedish!!!
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Definitely Not Swedish on July 28, 2018, 01:37:55 PM
I'm no expert, but it seems like that might not be the case? It seems it's pretty clearly defined that it can happen to both men and women.

(https://preview.ibb.co/cB0HYo/Capture.png)
But he's definitely not Swedish!!!
He's kinda stupid, it is known.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: Pezevenk on July 28, 2018, 01:48:22 PM
Talking about Sweden, I recently found out that Sweden became the first European country to declassify homosexuality as a mental illness in 1979 because activists for gay rights used the framework of the law to get a sick leave from work for being gay.
Title: Re: Consent
Post by: boydster on July 28, 2018, 01:58:56 PM
I'm no expert, but it seems like that might not be the case? It seems it's pretty clearly defined that it can happen to both men and women.

(https://preview.ibb.co/cB0HYo/Capture.png)
But he's definitely not Swedish!!!

Oh yeah. He's very definitely Definitely Not Swedish.