The Flat Earth Society

Flat Earth Discussion Boards => Flat Earth Debate => Topic started by: tinfoiltophat on August 05, 2016, 11:21:51 PM

Title: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: tinfoiltophat on August 05, 2016, 11:21:51 PM
The following groups attempt to claim that the Earth is round:Assuming that every one of them is lying, I doubt that not a single person who has first hand knowledge of the earth being flat has come forward to release details on the conspiracy. However, for all intents and purposes, allow us to assume that either these people have been co-erced, bribed, or perhaps they were also fooled into believing the globe earth theory. However, what are the potential motives that "the man" has, as far as keeping the truth about Flat Earth a secret goes?
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: ChildofFather on August 05, 2016, 11:58:25 PM
The following groups attempt to claim that the Earth is round:
  • The 7 countries with territorial claims on Antarctica (The alleged location of the Ice Wall)
  • The staffers of all the research bases in the Arctic
  • The top leaders of space programs of the US, the Soviet Union, and China
  • The 533 people that have allegedly orbited Earth
  • The 24 people that allegedly have gone beyond low-Earth orbit, and
  • The 12 people that allegedly set foot on the moon.
Assuming that every one of them is lying, I doubt that not a single person who has first hand knowledge of the earth being flat has come forward to release details on the conspiracy. However, for all intents and purposes, allow us to assume that either these people have been co-erced, bribed, or perhaps they were also fooled into believing the globe earth theory. However, what are the potential motives that "the man" has, as far as keeping the truth about Flat Earth a secret goes?


This is more than physical warfare, it is spiritual too. It is putting us as just little ants, creating slaves to selves. If people knew what they don't tell us about Antarctica, there would be far more adventurists and the truth would be told. First, it is rich in resources and greedy, powerful men plotted how to keep it for themselves. There is a lot of land left to discover and with so much land mass, there should be thousands of researcher's studying there. At the rate they are going it will take generations to gain a small fraction of research: And it shouldn't be so darn difficult and expensive to go there. Only the Elite can even afford a trip there.

Second, after the moon hoax, they couldn't take the lie back, or didn't care, and began to steal our tax money. They kept the lie going. Why can't people just admit it? Why won't they? This deception goes so deep even the rabbit can't keep up. Why can't anyone, if they can afford the ticket, not visit space? What gives them the right to hoard and hide our surrounding's? Why am I not good enough to go to space but they are? It's BS and the biggest hoax since time began. Think about it. If we could really go to space, wouldn't public tour's, like, be "the thing?" Wouldn't Johny be telling all his friend's about the space tour he took during summer vacation? It makes no sense to me, only evil to not share.

I'm telling you, you need to come up out of that hole you have been living in and get some fresh air for a change.
Admitting you have been deceived is the first step to freedom.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: Antares__ on August 06, 2016, 12:40:21 AM
The government is promoting the message of the devil.

The round earth is a message of the devil.

Therefore the gods I know exist are of the flat earth...

The truth.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: TheRealBillNye on August 06, 2016, 01:38:43 AM
First, it is rich in resources and greedy, powerful men plotted how to keep it for themselves. There is a lot of land left to discover and with so much land mass
Under an FE model nobody can possibly extract resources from Antarctica, let alone get there in the first place.

Second, after the moon hoax
[citation needed]

Stopped reading right there buddy. You think the moon landings was faked? Then why can I bounce a laser off of a mirror that humans placed upon the moon and get a result back?
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: rabinoz on August 06, 2016, 01:41:00 AM
The government is promoting the message of the devil.
The round earth is a message of the devil.
Therefore the gods I know exist are of the flat earth...
The truth.
There are many very fundamentalist Christians who disagree with you.
Quote from: Jonathan Sarfati
The flat earth myth
For the last 200 years or so, many anti-Christians have resorted to a scurrilous lie (acting consistently with their worldview): that the early and medieval Christian Church taught that the earth is flat.
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
 
“There never was a period of ‘flat earth darkness’ among scholars (regardless of how the public at large may have conceptualized our planet both then and now). Greek knowledge of sphericity never faded, and all major medieval scholars accepted the earth’s roundness as an established fact of cosmology."
From: Creation.com, The flat earth myth. (http://creation.com/flat-earth-myth)

So just be careful who are accusing when you say the "round earth is a message of the devil". 
Judge not, that ye be not judged.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: TheRealBillNye on August 06, 2016, 01:42:19 AM
The government is promoting the message of the devil.

The round earth is a message of the devil.

Therefore the gods I know exist are of the flat earth...

The truth.

Would you like to post scripture saying the earth is flat?

Also, Gods? As in more than one God? Looks like you need to brush up on your 10 commandments Thou shalt have no other gods before me.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: kido.resuri on August 06, 2016, 02:03:40 AM
You think the moon landings was faked? Then why can I bounce a laser off of a mirror that humans placed upon the moon and get a result back?
Can you? I mean you, personally can do it? Please confirm your experiment with evidentical proof.


The moon landing ...
(http://i.stack.imgur.com/DCx8x.jpg)
Do you really believe that with this vehicle, made of cardboard, tin foil and duct tape, they actually landed on the moon, later they took off from it? And that they could go through the Van Allen belt's radiation? Today, they claim that they have to work on a solution to get through the belt's radiation without killing the crew and damaging the instruments. That is why they can't go back to moon.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: rabinoz on August 06, 2016, 02:08:16 AM
I'm telling you, you need to come up out of that hole you have been living in and get some fresh air for a change.
Admitting you have been deceived is the first step to freedom.

I could say that "you need to come up out of that hole you have been living in and get some fresh air for a change." 
Get out and really look about you at sunrises, sunsets and the moon etc.

My belief in the Globe has nothing to do with NASA, governments or any indoctrination.
I know it is a Globe because of what I see around me with my own eyes.

Here are ten bits of "evidence" that I see with my own eyes:
These do not categorically PROVE that the earth is a Globe, to be they provide very strong visual evidence.

None of this is direct evidence of a rotating earth, but I believe it is strong evidence of a Globe with a distant (that is far further than the earths size) sun and moon.

I have posted what I think is ONE proof in Measurements of the Earth Prove it cannot be Flat (https://www.theflatearthsociety.org/forum/index.php?topic=66646.0).
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: truthterra on August 06, 2016, 02:51:16 AM
The government has the same clue as a garbage worker about the flat earth.
The conspiracy that the government is so almighty is pathetic, the government is built upon lots of people which are being deluded by non-human entities.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: rabinoz on August 06, 2016, 03:37:08 AM
The government has the same clue as a garbage worker about the flat earth.
The conspiracy that the government is so almighty is pathetic, the government is built upon lots of people which are being deluded by non-human entities.
Wow, what an imagination!
::) I suppose NASA is run by the lizard men.  ::)
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: Space Cowgirl on August 06, 2016, 10:00:27 AM
The following groups attempt to claim that the Earth is round:
  • The 7 countries with territorial claims on Antarctica (The alleged location of the Ice Wall)
  • The staffers of all the research bases in the Arctic
  • The top leaders of space programs of the US, the Soviet Union, and China
  • The 533 people that have allegedly orbited Earth
  • The 24 people that allegedly have gone beyond low-Earth orbit, and
  • The 12 people that allegedly set foot on the moon.
Assuming that every one of them is lying, I doubt that not a single person who has first hand knowledge of the earth being flat has come forward to release details on the conspiracy. However, for all intents and purposes, allow us to assume that either these people have been co-erced, bribed, or perhaps they were also fooled into believing the globe earth theory. However, what are the potential motives that "the man" has, as far as keeping the truth about Flat Earth a secret goes?

Most of them are not purposely lying.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: Triddles on August 06, 2016, 12:50:56 PM
Why does anyone lie? they have something to gain.

The people from outside the known Earth are the sponsors and benefactors to most governments, and they own all the land not covered on maps. The southern hemisphere is larger on a flat earth, yet the maps don't allow for this, so what of all this missing land? there are mineral rich plains, spoken of in legend like El Dorado, and all that precious metal and gems and oils are mined and used, giving a great advantage and great gains. And on this unknown land, there is no need to worry about human rights, and the natives could be used as slaves.
So long as no one thinks to question, so long as no one knows, there are huge tracts of land to be used and abused, and no need to worry how the working conditions might seem.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: JoshPerplexed on August 06, 2016, 01:17:53 PM
The moon landing ...
And that they could go through the Van Allen belt's radiation? Today, they claim that they have to work on a solution to get through the belt's radiation without killing the crew and damaging the instruments. That is why they can't go back to moon.

This shit gets more ridiculous every time you people repeat it!! NASA never said they couldn't get through the belts.. But now, apparently, it will kill them just by going through them!! 

Maybe you people should consider reading about the Van Allen Belts from people who actually know what they're talking about, instead of flat earthers and moon hoaxers.....
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: JoshPerplexed on August 06, 2016, 01:22:25 PM
Why does anyone lie? they have something to gain.

The people from outside the known Earth are the sponsors and benefactors to most governments, and they own all the land not covered on maps. The southern hemisphere is larger on a flat earth, yet the maps don't allow for this, so what of all this missing land? there are mineral rich plains, spoken of in legend like El Dorado, and all that precious metal and gems and oils are mined and used, giving a great advantage and great gains. And on this unknown land, there is no need to worry about human rights, and the natives could be used as slaves.
So long as no one thinks to question, so long as no one knows, there are huge tracts of land to be used and abused, and no need to worry how the working conditions might seem.

So there's an unknown Earth..... And.... You know about it?????

The flat earth map is wrong! There's no "missing land"!!
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: tinfoiltophat on August 06, 2016, 04:03:55 PM
oh my god this thread is fucking hilarious i did not expect, let's take it from the top.

First, it is rich in resources and greedy, powerful men plotted how to keep it for themselves. There is a lot of land left to discover and with so much land mass, there should be thousands of researcher's studying there. At the rate they are going it will take generations to gain a small fraction of research: And it shouldn't be so darn difficult and expensive to go there. Only the Elite can even afford a trip there.

Second, after the moon hoax, they couldn't take the lie back, or didn't care, and began to steal our tax money. They kept the lie going. Why can't people just admit it? Why won't they? This deception goes so deep even the rabbit can't keep up. Why can't anyone, if they can afford the ticket, not visit space? What gives them the right to hoard and hide our surrounding's? Why am I not good enough to go to space but they are? It's BS and the biggest hoax since time began. Think about it. If we could really go to space, wouldn't public tour's, like, be "the thing?" Wouldn't Johny be telling all his friend's about the space tour he took during summer vacation? It makes no sense to me, only evil to not share.

I'm telling you, you need to come up out of that hole you have been living in and get some fresh air for a change.
Admitting you have been deceived is the first step to freedom.
this is fuckin great, let's pick apart the BS
Quote
First, it is rich in resources and greedy, powerful men plotted how to keep it for themselves. There is a lot of land left to discover and with so much land mass, there should be thousands of researcher's studying there. At the rate they are going it will take generations to gain a small fraction of research
aside from the fact that because nobody has come out and said this, you're probably just pulling this out of your ass, there's also the fact that it would actually be a lot cheaper to open up whatever is beyond the ice wall to the public, (for a fee, of course) and hire more people to harvest the "rich resources" located there. Keeping a giant wealth of untapped resources a secret from the public would actually prevent corporations from exploiting it effectively. You would also currently see sales that vastly outnumber the amount companies would be able to produce using only resources from the Earth we all know and love. Also, corporations could turn these swaths of land into giant malls and offices and great profitable commercial enterprises if they didn't keep it a secret from the rest of the world. You obviously aren't thinking like a TRUE evil corporation.
Quote
Why can't anyone, if they can afford the ticket, not visit space? What gives them the right to hoard and hide our surrounding's? Why am I not good enough to go to space but they are? It's BS and the biggest hoax since time began. Think about it. If we could really go to space, wouldn't public tour's, like, be "the thing?"
It's fucking expensive to go to space, therefore making it expensive to turn a profit to bring others to space. However, companies actually are planning on making space tourism a thing, (http://www.space.com/33629-virgin-galactic-spaceshiptwo-unity-tests-faa-license.html) although it is very expensive to take people into space, therefore very expensive to get a space tour. Also, if you meant that only heavily vetted NASA personnel were allowed into space, it's moreso that they need people who are extremely qualified to do repairs if something goes wrong, because space flight is a relatively new technology, and if something goes wrong on a rocket, well, there are a few risks. risks. (http://)
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: frenat on August 06, 2016, 06:16:27 PM
You think the moon landings was faked? Then why can I bounce a laser off of a mirror that humans placed upon the moon and get a result back?
Can you? I mean you, personally can do it? Please confirm your experiment with evidentical proof.


The moon landing ...
(http://i.stack.imgur.com/DCx8x.jpg)
Do you really believe that with this vehicle, made of cardboard, tin foil and duct tape, they actually landed on the moon, later they took off from it? And that they could go through the Van Allen belt's radiation? Today, they claim that they have to work on a solution to get through the belt's radiation without killing the crew and damaging the instruments. That is why they can't go back to moon.
I see no cardboard, tin foil or duct tape.  I see insulative materials, aluminized mylar and mylar tape.  The craft underneath that insulated layer looked quite sturdy.
(http://www.armaghplanet.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/Image-of-LM-under-construction.jpg)

and they went around the belts, not through them.




The supposed claim that they need a solution was a video where they were specifically talking about testing the electronics which are more sensitive than Apollo's.  They also want the ability to go through the center of the belts because due to the angle of the magnetic field and the angle of the Moon's orbit that path around them is not always available.  Also They can't go around them if they go to Mars.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: Woody on August 06, 2016, 09:34:14 PM
The moon landing ...
And that they could go through the Van Allen belt's radiation? Today, they claim that they have to work on a solution to get through the belt's radiation without killing the crew and damaging the instruments. That is why they can't go back to moon.

This shit gets more ridiculous every time you people repeat it!! NASA never said they couldn't get through the belts.. But now, apparently, it will kill them just by going through them!! 

Maybe you people should consider reading about the Van Allen Belts from people who actually know what they're talking about, instead of flat earthers and moon hoaxers.....

One of my favorite things is when a FE uses evidence gathered by sounding rockets to try and disprove space travel.  This means they need to acknowledge space travel is possible or they should not use something like the Van Allen Belts as evidence that space travel is not possible.

As for why it is an issue going to Mars is the ejection angle to get there.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: Nightsky on August 07, 2016, 12:54:16 AM
Nothing is being hidden from anyone...sure governments attempt to control certain aspects of how a country is run but to think things that relate to the shape and form of the Earth are being kept a secret is rather silly to say the least when the proof is all around you, just have to open your eyes. The initial question or statement is something of a non sequitur, what the question could have asked is ; what motivates to people think the governments of the world are hiding information from the worlds population in relation to the nature of the shape/form of the Earth.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: Sam Hill on August 07, 2016, 09:11:32 AM
The following groups attempt to claim that the Earth is round:


You left out a few (well, a LOT, actually):
For ships and planes, I say "before GPS", even though I know from my own experience that ships at sea do not blindly trust their GPS, but instead continue doing old school round earth navigation in case GPS equipment fails.

For the GPS item I am including only the systems used for long distance air and ocean travel.  Navigating from New York to Boston, flat vs round earth GPS probably makes very little difference, especially since your path is restricted to roads.  New York to Paris?  You're going to miss your destination if your GPS is giving you heading instructions based on a false geometry.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: Triddles on August 07, 2016, 12:43:46 PM
Why does anyone lie? they have something to gain.

The people from outside the known Earth are the sponsors and benefactors to most governments, and they own all the land not covered on maps. The southern hemisphere is larger on a flat earth, yet the maps don't allow for this, so what of all this missing land? there are mineral rich plains, spoken of in legend like El Dorado, and all that precious metal and gems and oils are mined and used, giving a great advantage and great gains. And on this unknown land, there is no need to worry about human rights, and the natives could be used as slaves.
So long as no one thinks to question, so long as no one knows, there are huge tracts of land to be used and abused, and no need to worry how the working conditions might seem.

So there's an unknown Earth..... And.... You know about it?????

The flat earth map is wrong! There's no "missing land"!!

I don't know much about it, but it is easy to tell that it must exist, because the given map does not work. There are distances that must be accounted for.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: wise on August 07, 2016, 11:51:58 PM
The world is governed by a gang aimed make to The people to know wrong about everything which possible. Thus it aims to maintain their power . and opponents have to solve a lot of lies . They are interested in one on one with the enemy of the few that solves all problems. For others just continue the lies.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: TheRealBillNye on August 08, 2016, 12:03:12 AM
Why does anyone lie? they have something to gain.

The people from outside the known Earth are the sponsors and benefactors to most governments, and they own all the land not covered on maps. The southern hemisphere is larger on a flat earth, yet the maps don't allow for this, so what of all this missing land? there are mineral rich plains, spoken of in legend like El Dorado, and all that precious metal and gems and oils are mined and used, giving a great advantage and great gains. And on this unknown land, there is no need to worry about human rights, and the natives could be used as slaves.
So long as no one thinks to question, so long as no one knows, there are huge tracts of land to be used and abused, and no need to worry how the working conditions might seem.

So there's an unknown Earth..... And.... You know about it?????

The flat earth map is wrong! There's no "missing land"!!

I don't know much about it, but it is easy to tell that it must exist, because the given map does not work. There are distances that must be accounted for.

Or maybe, just maybe, the given map does not work because the world is not flat? You said yourself you do not know much about it. Is it possible that you could be wrong?
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: bob_the_skywatcher on August 08, 2016, 04:21:12 AM
The world is governed by a gang aimed make to The people to know wrong about everything which possible.
Do you have any example what is possible in a FE world that the "gang" would not want the people to know about and what would make them powerful?
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: johnnyorbital on August 08, 2016, 04:48:25 AM
the most logical answer to this isn't quite what you may seem..

yes there's an elite who control the world governments, JFK and Woodrow Wilson both openly spoke about them, its not new news

here's the trail I followed:
Admiral Byrd went on an expedition to Antarctica
He reported masses of natural resources and stated that he expected many more expeditions to 'the continent of Antarctica'
Soon after the Antarctic Treaty was signed
..and the massive ice shelf there was renamed 'The Rockefella Plateau'

then the flat earth theory started doing the rounds again, kicked off with a school project about a lady named Andrea Barnes

well, it seems pretty obvious to me
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: Nightsky on August 08, 2016, 06:24:26 AM
The world is governed by a gang aimed make to The people to know wrong about everything which possible. Thus it aims to maintain their power . and opponents have to solve a lot of lies . They are interested in one on one with the enemy of the few that solves all problems. For others just continue the lies.

If thats the case I am sure you must have a great deal of evidence to back up your claim. It would be really helpful if you could share it. One some caveat...it gas to be credible and verifiable.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: wise on August 08, 2016, 06:30:38 AM
The world is governed by a gang aimed make to The people to know wrong about everything which possible.
Do you have any example what is possible in a FE world that the "gang" would not want the people to know about and what would make them powerful?

The gang knows the example better than us. None of us know all of the results of what we think the earth is a globe instead of a flat. I have some examples about this question but i'm not sure if it fully meet to your question. I can give examples of some of the results but don't know all of them because i'm not a member of that global gang.

Nukes are lies. This is not directly related to the shape of the earth. But this shows what a lie causes. With this lie, you can control all over the world by threatening with use to nuclear weapons.

The shape of the earth lie generally causes to continue NASA lies with it's allies. USA, Russia, China, Japan and other allies say they gone to the space. This lie causes do control to the other countries. Because the power can gone to the space can control the world. This ensures technological superiority to other countries by perception study .

NASA gathering about 20 billion dollars using clean money in the dirty work and supporting terrorism. If it not, how can USA supports the terrorist groups. 20 billion dollars mean 20 milion people dying with this lie.

If NASA and allies accept the earth is a flat, then no dirty money, no terrorism.

If NASA and allies accept the earth is a flat, then no chaos on Iraq, Syria, middle east, Afghanistan, Somali, ... etc. Freedom will increase than. Because The importance of global power countries effect will be reduced.

In my opinion both of supporting to shape of round is same with supporting to terrorism, or take someone 's freedom back, or cutting a man's head.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: wise on August 08, 2016, 06:37:20 AM
The world is governed by a gang aimed make to The people to know wrong about everything which possible. Thus it aims to maintain their power . and opponents have to solve a lot of lies . They are interested in one on one with the enemy of the few that solves all problems. For others just continue the lies.

If thats the case I am sure you must have a great deal of evidence to back up your claim. It would be really helpful if you could share it. One some caveat...it gas to be credible and verifiable.

Is My whole goal is to gather evidence and to produce sturdy for everybody? Can you disprove it by a big deal of evidence ?
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: johnnyorbital on August 08, 2016, 07:10:48 AM
this guy really thinks that if everyone ignored all the evidence and believed the world is flat, there'd be peace in the middle east?

I'll order can ounce of what he's smoking please
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: neutrino on August 08, 2016, 08:04:58 AM
As a resident of Middle East I can say that peace will never be here.

Flat Earther want ... what? Evidence? That the Earth is a globe? You guys are funny. All this forum is full of evidences. Flat Earth makes more problems than explains things. Take satellites, moon phases, moon phace, gravity... I can type a ton here. Globe is a one answer to all of these.

You can theorize that Antarctica is guarded. I can theorize that it's guarded by Pokemons. You know those yellow Pikachus. Yes those exactly. 
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: ChildofFather on August 08, 2016, 08:00:28 PM
First, it is rich in resources and greedy, powerful men plotted how to keep it for themselves. There is a lot of land left to discover and with so much land mass
Under an FE model nobody can possibly extract resources from Antarctica, let alone get there in the first place.

Second, after the moon hoax
[citation needed]

Stopped reading right there buddy. You think the moon landings was faked? Then why can I bounce a laser off of a mirror that humans placed upon the moon and get a result back?

Ummmm...there are no laser's that can reach the moon...lol. Nice try though.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: rabinoz on August 08, 2016, 09:44:01 PM
First, it is rich in resources and greedy, powerful men plotted how to keep it for themselves. There is a lot of land left to discover and with so much land mass
Under an FE model nobody can possibly extract resources from Antarctica, let alone get there in the first place.

Second, after the moon hoax
[citation needed]

Stopped reading right there buddy. You think the moon landings was faked? Then why can I bounce a laser off of a mirror that humans placed upon the moon and get a result back?

Ummmm...there are no laser's that can reach the moon...lol. Nice try though.

Like most flat earthers you just come out with totally unsubstantiated statements. There were radar measurements as early as 1957.
Quote from: Wikipedia
Lunar Distance, Radar
An experiment was conducted in 1957 at the U.S. Naval Research Laboratory that used the echo from radar signals to determine the Earth-Moon distance. Radar pulses lasting 2 µs were broadcast from a 50 ft diameter radio dish. After the radio waves echoed off the surface of the Moon, the return signal was detected and the delay time measured. From that measurement, the distance could be calculated. In practice, however, the signal-to-noise ratio was so low that an accurate measurement could not be reliably produced.

The experiment was repeated in 1958 at the Royal Radar Establishment, in England. Radar pulses lasting 5 µs were transmitted with a peak power of 2 megawatts, at a repetition rate of 260 pulses per second. After the radio waves echoed off the surface of the Moon, the return signal was detected and the delay time measured. Multiple signals were added together to obtain a reliable signal by superimposing oscilloscope traces onto photographic film. From the measurements, the distance was calculated with an uncertainty of 1.25 km.

These initial experiments were intended to be proof-of-concept experiments and only lasted one day. Follow-on experiments lasting one month produced a mean value of 384402±1.2 km, which was the most accurate measurement of the lunar distance at the time.
From Lunar distance (astronomy) Radar (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lunar_distance_(astronomy)#Radar)

And there were laser's that could reach the moon in 1962 - yes even before the lunar landings.
Quote from: Wikipedia
Lunar Laser Ranging experiment
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
The first successful tests were carried out in 1962 when a team from the Massachusetts Institute of Technology succeeded in observing laser pulses reflected from moon's surface using a laser with a millisecond pulse length. Similar measurements were obtained later the same year by a Soviet team at the Crimean Astrophysical Observatory using a Q-switched ruby laser. Greater accuracy was achieved following the installation of a retroreflector array on July 21, 1969, by the crew of Apollo 11, and two more retroreflector arrays left by the Apollo 14 and Apollo 15 missions have also contributed to the experiment. Successful lunar laser range measurements to the retroreflectors were first reported by the 3.1 m telescope at Lick Observatory, Air Force Cambridge Research Laboratories Lunar Ranging Observatory in Arizona, the Pic du Midi Observatory in France, the Tokyo Astronomical Observatory, and McDonald Observatory in Texas.

You must really enjoy all these conspiracies you go in for.  :) Still, if it keeps you happy!  :)
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: Aliveandkicking on August 08, 2016, 10:26:48 PM
First, it is rich in resources and greedy, powerful men plotted how to keep it for themselves. There is a lot of land left to discover and with so much land mass
Under an FE model nobody can possibly extract resources from Antarctica, let alone get there in the first place.

Second, after the moon hoax
[citation needed]

Stopped reading right there buddy. You think the moon landings was faked? Then why can I bounce a laser off of a mirror that humans placed upon the moon and get a result back?

Ummmm...there are no laser's that can reach the moon...lol. Nice try though.

Like most flat earthers you just come out with totally unsubstantiated statements. There were radar measurements as early as 1957.
Quote from: Wikipedia
Lunar Distance, Radar
An experiment was conducted in 1957 at the U.S. Naval Research Laboratory that used the echo from radar signals to determine the Earth-Moon distance. Radar pulses lasting 2 µs were broadcast from a 50 ft diameter radio dish. After the radio waves echoed off the surface of the Moon, the return signal was detected and the delay time measured. From that measurement, the distance could be calculated. In practice, however, the signal-to-noise ratio was so low that an accurate measurement could not be reliably produced.

The experiment was repeated in 1958 at the Royal Radar Establishment, in England. Radar pulses lasting 5 µs were transmitted with a peak power of 2 megawatts, at a repetition rate of 260 pulses per second. After the radio waves echoed off the surface of the Moon, the return signal was detected and the delay time measured. Multiple signals were added together to obtain a reliable signal by superimposing oscilloscope traces onto photographic film. From the measurements, the distance was calculated with an uncertainty of 1.25 km.

These initial experiments were intended to be proof-of-concept experiments and only lasted one day. Follow-on experiments lasting one month produced a mean value of 384402±1.2 km, which was the most accurate measurement of the lunar distance at the time.
From Lunar distance (astronomy) Radar (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lunar_distance_(astronomy)#Radar)

And there were laser's that could reach the moon in 1962 - yes even before the lunar landings.
Quote from: Wikipedia
Lunar Laser Ranging experiment
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
The first successful tests were carried out in 1962 when a team from the Massachusetts Institute of Technology succeeded in observing laser pulses reflected from moon's surface using a laser with a millisecond pulse length. Similar measurements were obtained later the same year by a Soviet team at the Crimean Astrophysical Observatory using a Q-switched ruby laser. Greater accuracy was achieved following the installation of a retroreflector array on July 21, 1969, by the crew of Apollo 11, and two more retroreflector arrays left by the Apollo 14 and Apollo 15 missions have also contributed to the experiment. Successful lunar laser range measurements to the retroreflectors were first reported by the 3.1 m telescope at Lick Observatory, Air Force Cambridge Research Laboratories Lunar Ranging Observatory in Arizona, the Pic du Midi Observatory in France, the Tokyo Astronomical Observatory, and McDonald Observatory in Texas.

You must really enjoy all these conspiracies you go in for.  :) Still, if it keeps you happy!  :)

Retro reflectors does not prove apollo 11.   The russians sent the lunar rover before apollo 11.  Retroreflectors are not required to be installed by humans.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: fliggs on August 08, 2016, 11:21:27 PM
The moon landing ...
And that they could go through the Van Allen belt's radiation? Today, they claim that they have to work on a solution to get through the belt's radiation without killing the crew and damaging the instruments. That is why they can't go back to moon.

This shit gets more ridiculous every time you people repeat it!! NASA never said they couldn't get through the belts.. But now, apparently, it will kill them just by going through them!! 

Maybe you people should consider reading about the Van Allen Belts from people who actually know what they're talking about, instead of flat earthers and moon hoaxers.....

Not to mention Van Allen himself who has no problem believing in space flight.  Any anyhow, the most potent protection against alpha radiation is surprisingly plastic sheeting a few mm thick.

I always thought moon hoaxers were the dumbest-of-the-dumb. And then I found the FEers.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: bob_the_skywatcher on August 08, 2016, 11:26:53 PM
The world is governed by a gang aimed make to The people to know wrong about everything which possible.
Do you have any example what is possible in a FE world that the "gang" would not want the people to know about and what would make them powerful?

The gang knows the example better than us. None of us know all of the results of what we think the earth is a globe instead of a flat. I have some examples about this question but i'm not sure if it fully meet to your question. I can give examples of some of the results but don't know all of them because i'm not a member of that global gang.

Nukes are lies. This is not directly related to the shape of the earth. But this shows what a lie causes. With this lie, you can control all over the world by threatening with use to nuclear weapons.

The shape of the earth lie generally causes to continue NASA lies with it's allies. USA, Russia, China, Japan and other allies say they gone to the space. This lie causes do control to the other countries. Because the power can gone to the space can control the world. This ensures technological superiority to other countries by perception study .

NASA gathering about 20 billion dollars using clean money in the dirty work and supporting terrorism. If it not, how can USA supports the terrorist groups. 20 billion dollars mean 20 milion people dying with this lie.

If NASA and allies accept the earth is a flat, then no dirty money, no terrorism.

If NASA and allies accept the earth is a flat, then no chaos on Iraq, Syria, middle east, Afghanistan, Somali, ... etc. Freedom will increase than. Because The importance of global power countries effect will be reduced.

In my opinion both of supporting to shape of round is same with supporting to terrorism, or take someone 's freedom back, or cutting a man's head.
You are wrong on all counts.
War and terrorism exist because of religion, territorial and political causes.
In fact, on a flat earth with all humans trapped on this earth and nowhere to expand, territorial wars will increase. What do you think will happen when a countries population becomes so larger that it cannot support them?

As long as "An eye for an eye" saying still exist, then there will never be peace in the middle east. That has nothing to do with your global power countries theory.

Nasa does not launch commercial satellites or payloads, it's the private companies like ULA, ILS and spaceX that launches payloads. Any country can develop their own launch industry or rent launches from the private launchers, so how can NASA have power?

In my opinion, supporting a flat earth is supporting selfishness, regression and territorial wars.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: wise on August 08, 2016, 11:30:02 PM
The world is governed by a gang aimed make to The people to know wrong about everything which possible.
Do you have any example what is possible in a FE world that the "gang" would not want the people to know about and what would make them powerful?

The gang knows the example better than us. None of us know all of the results of what we think the earth is a globe instead of a flat. I have some examples about this question but i'm not sure if it fully meet to your question. I can give examples of some of the results but don't know all of them because i'm not a member of that global gang.

Nukes are lies. This is not directly related to the shape of the earth. But this shows what a lie causes. With this lie, you can control all over the world by threatening with use to nuclear weapons.

The shape of the earth lie generally causes to continue NASA lies with it's allies. USA, Russia, China, Japan and other allies say they gone to the space. This lie causes do control to the other countries. Because the power can gone to the space can control the world. This ensures technological superiority to other countries by perception study .

NASA gathering about 20 billion dollars using clean money in the dirty work and supporting terrorism. If it not, how can USA supports the terrorist groups. 20 billion dollars mean 20 milion people dying with this lie.

If NASA and allies accept the earth is a flat, then no dirty money, no terrorism.

If NASA and allies accept the earth is a flat, then no chaos on Iraq, Syria, middle east, Afghanistan, Somali, ... etc. Freedom will increase than. Because The importance of global power countries effect will be reduced.

In my opinion both of supporting to shape of round is same with supporting to terrorism, or take someone 's freedom back, or cutting a man's head.
You are wrong on all counts.
War and terrorism exist because of religion, territorial and political causes.
In fact, on a flat earth with all humans trapped on this earth and nowhere to expand, territorial wars will increase. What do you think will happen when a countries population becomes so larger that it cannot support them?

As long as "An eye for an eye" saying still exist, then there will never be peace in the middle east. That has nothing to do with your global power countries theory.

Nasa does not launch commercial satellites or payloads, it's the private companies like ULA, ILS and spaceX that launches payloads. Any country can develop their own launch industry or rent launches from the private launchers, so how can NASA have power?

In my opinion, supporting a flat earth is supporting selfishness, regression and territorial wars.

You are just believing some lies. I pity you
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: fliggs on August 08, 2016, 11:34:51 PM
First, it is rich in resources and greedy, powerful men plotted how to keep it for themselves. There is a lot of land left to discover and with so much land mass
Under an FE model nobody can possibly extract resources from Antarctica, let alone get there in the first place.

Second, after the moon hoax
[citation needed]

Stopped reading right there buddy. You think the moon landings was faked? Then why can I bounce a laser off of a mirror that humans placed upon the moon and get a result back?

Ummmm...there are no laser's that can reach the moon...lol. Nice try though.

Other than all the ones that have been doing it thousands of times?
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: TheRealBillNye on August 08, 2016, 11:40:07 PM
Retro reflectors does not prove apollo 11.   The russians sent the lunar rover before apollo 11.  Retroreflectors are not required to be installed by humans.

Who cares? Either way, it proves the fact that we have landed an object on the moon and directed it to do at least 1 task, which was completed successfully
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: SpJunk on August 09, 2016, 10:38:01 AM
The government is promoting the message of the devil.

The round earth is a message of the devil.

Therefore the gods I know exist are of the flat earth...

The truth.

First of all, Church itself never said Earth is Flat.
They said it is Static.
And those are two different things.

Globe Earth was accepted more than 2000 years ago, when Disc Earth model was abandoned as useless and flawed.
It was LONG BEFORE NASA and other space agencies in the world.

God told us to be fruitful / fertile and multiply.
He is guiding us STEP by STEP, when our mind is ready for it.
He said "repopulate the Earth" and He knew we will overpopulate and need to spread to other planets.

Space agencies are trying to allow us to spread throughout the Universe.
If we live all in the same planet, the next big asteroid will kill us all.
Who will carry on the God's Word?

Denying example with dinosaurs won't make it disappear.

So, which one is REAL "message from the Devil"?
The one that encourages us to spread throughout the Universe?
Or the one that sabbotages space agencies and tries to keep us all in single planet?

I'd say the one that concentrates us all into same risk.

"Earth is flat, don't go, let's all die together."

And Church really never said the Earth is Flat.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: Space Cowgirl on August 09, 2016, 11:17:07 AM
The government is hiding the flat earth from us so they can play with fire.

(https://66.media.tumblr.com/d03075e0cfb5ed04df3aa8c642bbdb32/tumblr_obm5yh1WQj1qaityko1_540.gif)
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: SpJunk on August 09, 2016, 12:23:02 PM

Ummmm...there are no laser's that can reach the moon...lol. Nice try though.

Visit the Apache Point observatory, they have a laser, which beam does not only go to the moon, but does also come back.
McDonalds Observatory also has laser.

Looks like the try is even "nicer" than you thought. :-)
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: JRoweSkeptic on August 09, 2016, 04:10:46 PM
There is no intentional conspiracy to hide a flat Earth. The majority of supposed evidence is simple misinterpretation; all those observations have an explanation on a flat Earth also. However, RET is viewed as far stronger for one reason alone, and that reason is space travel.
Even non flat earthers believe this is faked. The motive for this is easy to see: it was the cold war, people did anything to gain a political advantage. They gave photos of a round earth simply because that's what they expected to see, the same way Jurassic Park doesn't have dinosaurs with feathers. However, as people take it as fact, the consequences immediately became unquestionable in the public eye. By now, the idea of refuting space travel has become so laughable in the public eye that no one does serious analysis, brushing it all off as conspiracy theories and quackery, without going through the factors themselves.

It's self-perpetuating too. As space travel is impossible (see my sig for the link to my model outline, where there is an explanation), and yet people treat the idea as ludicrous to propose it's impossible, no company will want to admit that they failed.

The only secret is that space travel is impossible. The flat Earth is easy to reach as a conclusion when you leave behind space travel, but no one would.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: Physicsteacher on August 09, 2016, 04:36:24 PM
There is no intentional conspiracy to hide a flat Earth. The majority of supposed evidence is simple misinterpretation; all those observations have an explanation on a flat Earth also. However, RET is viewed as far stronger for one reason alone, and that reason is space travel.
Even non flat earthers believe this is faked. The motive for this is easy to see: it was the cold war, people did anything to gain a political advantage. They gave photos of a round earth simply because that's what they expected to see, the same way Jurassic Park doesn't have dinosaurs with feathers. However, as people take it as fact, the consequences immediately became unquestionable in the public eye. By now, the idea of refuting space travel has become so laughable in the public eye that no one does serious analysis, brushing it all off as conspiracy theories and quackery, without going through the factors themselves.

It's self-perpetuating too. As space travel is impossible (see my sig for the link to my model outline, where there is an explanation), and yet people treat the idea as ludicrous to propose it's impossible, no company will want to admit that they failed.

The only secret is that space travel is impossible. The flat Earth is easy to reach as a conclusion when you leave behind space travel, but no one would.

This is simply incorrect. There are dozens of reasons besides space travel that prove the earth is round
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: JRoweSkeptic on August 09, 2016, 04:47:26 PM
"This is simply incorrect. There are dozens of reasons besides space travel that prove the earth is round."
Nothing proves that, beyond direct observation. There are many observations thought to be evidence for it, yes. Some may contradict some FE models, but that is a fault with those individual models, not FET as a whole. The DE model in particular does answer them.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: rabinoz on August 09, 2016, 06:41:25 PM
"This is simply incorrect. There are dozens of reasons besides space travel that prove the earth is round."
Nothing proves that, beyond direct observation. There are many observations thought to be evidence for it, yes. Some may contradict some FE models, but that is a fault with those individual models, not FET as a whole. The DE, model in particular, does answer them.

It with be more accurate to say "The DE model, in particular, does answer them some of them by an aether with completely unprovable properties."

I said "does answer them some of them" because even the DE does not get the known dimensions of the earth correct.

The distance from either pole to the equator is very close to 10,000 km and the circumference of the earth at the equator is very close to 40,000 km.

But on any flat earth (single or dual) the circumference has to be 2 x π x (distance pole to equator), so even your Dual Earth does not fit.

To fit the measured dimensions the earth has to have its "curvature"!
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: SpJunk on August 09, 2016, 08:04:36 PM
...
Some may contradict some FE models, but that is a fault with those individual models, not FET as a whole.
The DE model in particular does answer them.

Went to your link, saw some things.
Haven't found map, only sketch of concept.
Saw only several FAQs, none answers few vital questions that come in mind.

For example:
How to use DE model to calculate field of illumination based on position of Sun?
What causes astronomical or geodesic horizontals to tilt by one degree to each other if 69 miles apart?
What causes apparent horizon dip, known to be important factor while using sextant?
(Sextant is used at night as well, to measure elevatrions of any known star, not only polar ones.
One degree error makes position error of 60 nautical miles.)

There's more, these three are just first ones.
Didn't register there, because lately avoid registrations, did it too many times before.
Hate remembering so many passwords or searching so many pages for them.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: bob_the_skywatcher on August 10, 2016, 01:09:08 AM
There is no intentional conspiracy to hide a flat Earth. The majority of supposed evidence is simple misinterpretation; all those observations have an explanation on a flat Earth also. However, RET is viewed as far stronger for one reason alone, and that reason is space travel.
Even non flat earthers believe this is faked. The motive for this is easy to see: it was the cold war, people did anything to gain a political advantage. They gave photos of a round earth simply because that's what they expected to see, the same way Jurassic Park doesn't have dinosaurs with feathers. However, as people take it as fact, the consequences immediately became unquestionable in the public eye. By now, the idea of refuting space travel has become so laughable in the public eye that no one does serious analysis, brushing it all off as conspiracy theories and quackery, without going through the factors themselves.

It's self-perpetuating too. As space travel is impossible (see my sig for the link to my model outline, where there is an explanation), and yet people treat the idea as ludicrous to propose it's impossible, no company will want to admit that they failed.

The only secret is that space travel is impossible. The flat Earth is easy to reach as a conclusion when you leave behind space travel, but no one would.
That motive went to shit the moment the private industry started launcing rockets and satellites. There is no way a private company would knowingly loose millions of dollars just to uphold a secret.
So what do all the satellite building companies do?, What do all the rocket builders do?, why does tv broadcasting companies order satellites and rockets for millions of dollars if they do not send them up?
What are the rockets that everyone sees, hears and feels launching?

Volkswagen got caught cheating with diesel emissions ffs! You don't think the whole aerospace industry would get caught if everything was faked? Come on.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: rabinoz on August 10, 2016, 05:14:53 AM
Back to the OP for a bit.

The following groups attempt to claim that the Earth is round:
  • The 7 countries with territorial claims on Antarctica (The alleged location of the Ice Wall)
  • The staffers of all the research bases in the Arctic
  • The top leaders of space programs of the US, the Soviet Union, and China
  • The 533 people that have allegedly orbited Earth
  • The 24 people that allegedly have gone beyond low-Earth orbit, and
  • The 12 people that allegedly set foot on the moon.
Assuming that every one of them is lying, I doubt that not a single person who has first hand knowledge of the earth being flat has come forward to release details on the conspiracy. However, for all intents and purposes, allow us to assume that either these people have been co-erced, bribed, or perhaps they were also fooled into believing the globe earth theory. However, what are the potential motives that "the man" has, as far as keeping the truth about Flat Earth a secret goes?

While "tinfoiltophat" lists a limited number of people who would "have to be lying", there is an extremely large number of people who just go about their work performing tasks that would not work the same, if at all, on a flat earth.

This group would include at least:
These people just go about their work based on the Globe Earth. If the earth were flat and not rotating many of these tasks would be performed quite differently and the people involved would certainly know the difference.

Somehow I think that it would need to be much more the just the government hiding "the truth".

Mind you, when I hear anyone claiming to have "The Truth", I get immediately get suspicious of what is being peddled!
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: JRoweSkeptic on August 10, 2016, 06:34:10 AM
"I said "does answer them some of them" because even the DE does not get the known dimensions of the earth correct."
How do you know those dimensions are accurate?

"Saw only several FAQs, none answers few vital questions that come in mind."
Hardly vital. first is a matter of resources and time rather than theory, and I suspect the latter two are the same, but can't be sure as they're incoherent. And like I said in the page linked to, you don't need to register.

"There is no way a private company would knowingly loose millions of dollars just to uphold a secret."
It's not knowingly. They try, find it's impossible, work out work-arounds (stratellites are well described under classical FET) and there you go.

"What are the rockets that everyone sees, hears and feels launching?"
Rockets. They exist, they just can't get to space.

"Volkswagen got caught cheating with diesel emissions ffs! You don't think the whole aerospace industry would get caught if everything was faked?"
Volkswagen cars are easily accessible.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: Nightsky on August 10, 2016, 10:24:36 AM
The following groups attempt to claim that the Earth is round:
  • The 7 countries with territorial claims on Antarctica (The alleged location of the Ice Wall)
  • The staffers of all the research bases in the Arctic
  • The top leaders of space programs of the US, the Soviet Union, and China
  • The 533 people that have allegedly orbited Earth
  • The 24 people that allegedly have gone beyond low-Earth orbit, and
  • The 12 people that allegedly set foot on the moon.
Assuming that every one of them is lying, I doubt that not a single person who has first hand knowledge of the earth being flat has come forward to release details on the conspiracy. However, for all intents and purposes, allow us to assume that either these people have been co-erced, bribed, or perhaps they were also fooled into believing the globe earth theory. However, what are the potential motives that "the man" has, as far as keeping the truth about Flat Earth a secret goes?

We are coming to get you....NASA and the boys have had enough..... prepare to be assimilated, you know it makes sense.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: John87 on August 10, 2016, 12:50:49 PM
You think the moon landings was faked? Then why can I bounce a laser off of a mirror that humans placed upon the moon and get a result back?
Can you? I mean you, personally can do it? Please confirm your experiment with evidentical proof.


The moon landing ...
Do you really believe that with this vehicle, made of cardboard, tin foil and duct tape, they actually landed on the moon, later they took off from it? And that they could go through the Van Allen belt's radiation? Today, they claim that they have to work on a solution to get through the belt's radiation without killing the crew and damaging the instruments. That is why they can't go back to moon.

Just because the Moon landings were faked doesn't mean the Earth is flat.

I'm not sure why these two separate issues constantly get equated, there are hundreds more examples of the US government lying through its teeth. It goes without saying.

If the flat Earth is to be taken seriously it needs to be proven conclusively. Relying on the 'Bedford Level Experiment' some sh*tty experiment 100 years ago over and over again just won't cut.

Besides everyone knows the Earth is shaped like the back of Patrick Stewart's head...
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: rabinoz on August 10, 2016, 03:55:49 PM
"I said "does answer them some of them" because even the DE does not get the known dimensions of the earth correct."
How do you know those dimensions are accurate?

How accurate would you need to be to tell the difference between 40,000 km and 62,800 km?
Not very!

The metre was defined as
(distance from the equator to the north pole on the latitude through Paris)/10,000,0000

The nautical mile was originally defined as one minute of arc of longitude at the equator or of latitude.
Quote from: OnlineConversion
What is a knot? What is a nautical mile?
. . . . . .  The nautical mile was based on the circumference of the earth at the equator. Since the earth is 360 degrees of longitude around, and degrees are broken into 60 so-called "minutes", that means there are 360 * 60 = 21,600 "minutes" of longitude around the earth. This was taken as the basis for the nautical mile; thus, by definition, 1 minute of longitude at the equator is equal to 1 nautical mile. So the earth is ideally, by definition, 21,600 nautical miles (and 21,600 "minutes" of longitude) in circumference at the equator. If anyone ever asks you how far is it around the earth, you can quickly do the math in your head (360 degrees * 60 minutes per degree) and answer "about 21,600 nautical miles!"
from OnlineConversion (http://www.onlineconversion.com/faq_07.htm).
And 21,600 nautical miles = 40003.2 km. About 40,075,016.6856 m, if you are really fussy!
You will have every ship's navigator down on your head
if you claim anything else, or that a degree of latitude is significantly different from a degree of longitude at the equator!
Do I need to explain it more? I can draw pictures if you like!

What is the circumference of the equator on your DE?
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: JRoweSkeptic on August 10, 2016, 04:26:06 PM
"How accurate would you need to be to tell the difference between 40,000 km and 62,800 km?"
Well you'd need someone taking the right journey with perfect knowledge of wind or sea conditions to begin with. It's not exactly a feasible distance to measure.

"What is the circumference of the equator on your DE?"
No idea, you have the same resources as me, you measure the equator, let me know what you find. You have to know how stupid that question is. I'm not going to blindly quote round earth belief, I'm concerned with fact, and I do not have the resources to map that out.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: rabinoz on August 10, 2016, 08:18:50 PM
"How accurate would you need to be to tell the difference between 40,000 km and 62,800 km?"
Well you'd need someone taking the right journey with perfect knowledge of wind or sea conditions to begin with. It's not exactly a feasible distance to measure.

"What is the circumference of the equator on your DE?"
No idea, you have the same resources as me, you measure the equator, let me know what you find. You have to know how stupid that question is. I'm not going to blindly quote round earth belief, I'm concerned with fact, and I do not have the resources to map that out.

It's your model!

Look, we know the size and shapes of all continents and countries.
We know the circumference of equator of the real earth (globe, flat or egg-shaped).
We know the distance from the equator to the North or South Pole.

If your earth is a flat disc, its radius must be almost exactly 10,000 km.

How hard is it to work out that the circumference must be 2 x π x 10,000 km or close 62,832 km?

Or are you going to claim that all measurements of the earth have been made by these "Masonic Geodesic Surveyors", and so are all faked?

It does seem strange that whenever I have taken road journeys the distances given by GPS, car odometer, maps and road signs have agreed to far better accuracy than that needed here. I have travelled by road for many tens of thousands of km around Australia and over 8,000 km around the UK.

We are not talking about errors of ±0.1%! If you know these dimensions to ±10% (or even 60%!) you can prove one model over the other! This applies to your model and more so to the single disk FET.

Careful measurements of the earth can determine its shape, and if flat earthers would pull their collective heads out of the sand they would realise that we already have those measurements.

No, the maps we have now are quite accurate, and the agree to quite good accuracy with surveyed maps over 150 years old, so it's no recent "NASA conspiracy".

You do need to "get real" and stop living in your own little dreamworld!

Still, I guess everyone needs a hobby and it's better than robbing little old ladies!
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: TheRealBillNye on August 10, 2016, 11:11:33 PM
The government is hiding the flat earth from us so they can play with fire.

(https://66.media.tumblr.com/d03075e0cfb5ed04df3aa8c642bbdb32/tumblr_obm5yh1WQj1qaityko1_540.gif)

Wow that's an awesome .gif
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: fliggs on August 10, 2016, 11:37:15 PM
The thread title is in fact a brilliant and far-reaching question. WHY? Why would the government hide a flat earth from us? What possible reason would exist for that? And remember it has to be ALL governments, ALL astronomers, ALL pilots, ALL sailors, ALL scientists and the list goes on. So no one has really ever come up with a rationale for this conspiracy. Probably because the word rationale contains the word RATIONAL and there is absolutely nothing even remotely rational about a flat earth conspiracy.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: Woody on August 11, 2016, 12:08:56 AM
My favorite reason I heard was Hollywood would lose money.  The reason people would not be interested in paying to see sci-fi movies like Star Wars.

I wish I could remember where I saw someone making that claim.  It might of been here or the other site whose mention gets censored here.  Could have been in a comment section of a youtube video when I first realized people were actively promoting the Earth was flat.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: Sam Hill on August 11, 2016, 05:51:37 AM
There is no intentional conspiracy to hide a flat Earth. The majority of supposed evidence is simple misinterpretation; all those observations have an explanation on a flat Earth also. However, RET is viewed as far stronger for one reason alone, and that reason is space travel...The only secret is that space travel is impossible. The flat Earth is easy to reach as a conclusion when you leave behind space travel, but no one would.
It must strike you as quite odd then, whenever you read about people hundreds of years before space flight who nevertheless believed the earth to be round.

For example, there is the Behaim Globe, currently the oldest known surviving globe representation of the earth anywhere in the world.  It was produced in 1492, before the discovery of the "new world", and is currently housed (but not displayed) at the Germanisches Nationalmuseum (http://www.gnm.de/forschung/forschungsprojekte/digitalisierung-behaim-globus/) (Germanic National Museum) in Nürnberger (Nuremberg).  It depicts a round earth that is smaller than it turned out to be, with North and South America still undiscovered and Japan much closer to Europe than it truly is.  Japan is the grossly oversized island on the left, while on the far right limb of the globe you can see the British Isles, the Iberian Peninsula (Spain and Portugal) and West Africa.
(http://cartographic-images.net/Cartographic_Images/258_Behaim_Globe_files/droppedImage_4.png)

This is but one example of a RE artifact produced before the existence of space flight, or the existence of NASA, or even the existence of the nation that eventually created NASA, or even knowledge of the continent from which it would eventually operate! 

I see FE proponents using the "space flight is fake" reasoning all over the forum as if it makes for a strong argument; it does the opposite.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: SkyCrossbones on August 11, 2016, 07:51:30 AM
This is more than physical warfare, it is spiritual too. It is putting us as just little ants, creating slaves to selves. If people knew what they don't tell us about Antarctica, there would be far more adventurists and the truth would be told. First, it is rich in resources and greedy, powerful men plotted how to keep it for themselves. There is a lot of land left to discover and with so much land mass, there should be thousands of researcher's studying there. At the rate they are going it will take generations to gain a small fraction of research: And it shouldn't be so darn difficult and expensive to go there. Only the Elite can even afford a trip there.

Second, after the moon hoax, they couldn't take the lie back, or didn't care, and began to steal our tax money. They kept the lie going. Why can't people just admit it? Why won't they? This deception goes so deep even the rabbit can't keep up. Why can't anyone, if they can afford the ticket, not visit space? What gives them the right to hoard and hide our surrounding's? Why am I not good enough to go to space but they are? It's BS and the biggest hoax since time began. Think about it. If we could really go to space, wouldn't public tour's, like, be "the thing?" Wouldn't Johny be telling all his friend's about the space tour he took during summer vacation? It makes no sense to me, only evil to not share.

I'm telling you, you need to come up out of that hole you have been living in and get some fresh air for a change.
Admitting you have been deceived is the first step to freedom.

I have to say, this is vague and false.
First of all going to Antarctica, round trip, would cost you around the figure of 10'000 USD, I spent that in one night in Vegas and it was the same cost of my Europe tour (including shopping and accommodation). Climbing mount Everest costs about 35'000 USD (Permit alone is 10k)

Second, space travel is not exclusive to the elite because they are elite. It's because space travel is expensive in it's nature.
This is the fallacy of Post hoc ergo propter hoc. AKA Questionable cause. If it's so easy to travel to space just like climbing mount Everest then cough up 35k see if it's enough, I know you didn't say that, but you do imply they aren't taking people to space tours, which they do, If you can't pay a huge sum of money, then space travel is not in your budget, just like Mount Everest or Antartica.

B.o.B's net worth is 1.7 billion, he can very well afford multiple trips to space. It's about 20-40 million USD (not adjusted to inflation), the Russian government does that, just contact their space agency and you will be shot in a Soyuz into space in no time. And if you don't like their government, then Virgin Galactic and Space X are American private corporations that will provide space travel in our life time, probably even cheaper, I bet we will see more corporations going into this business in the future.

Lastly, all you are doing in your post is preaching, and not providing factual information.

You are saying that Antarctica is full of riches and the men in suits are keeping it away from us.

Wait, I thought they aren't letting anyone go there, how do you know there are riches?

Wasn't Antarctica just ice walls?

I am having trouble with your preachy yet full of contradictory input.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: Cartog on August 11, 2016, 08:44:50 AM
The concept of a Round Earth was accepted by many educated people well before the time of Columbus.  But the suggestion that it is "the government" that is hiding the flatness of the earth requires either believing or ignoring certain things.  For one, it means EVERY government in every country on Earth for the past (e.g.) four hundred years; each new administration, new ruler, new parliamentary leadership, in every nation, for at least four centuries.  Some of those countries couldn't possibly have made a profit over falsifying the contours of the Earth, so why would they lie? Some of those governments are at war with each other and could certainly cause social collapse in the enemy country by spilling the beans about how their government is lying to them about the shape of the planet, but even that doesn't happen.

Then, the fact that governments are usually secondary in the announcements of facts to scientists.  Scientists in every country on Earth for the past four centuries have talked up the Round Earth, come up with new evidences of its roundness, and so forth, and thereafter the governments repeat the scientists' claims.  Certainly many (probably the vast majority) of those scientists couldn't possibly have made a profit over falsiflying the contours, etc., so why would they lie?  And consider their unanimity, even when a scientist knows that announcing a revolutionary discovery about the configuration of the planet would get him fame, fortune, and probably pretty lab assistants.

Plausibly, how long could a lie about the shape of the Earth continue into the 21st century?  Lots of aviation, lots of weather satellites, etc.  Really, jets can fly at such heights that they can fly over the East Coast and glimpse the Appalachian moutain range -- so they could fly over the Antarctic Circle and see well beyond the ice walls (and what they see is the other side of Antarctica as it is depicted on the usual Round Earth globes and maps).
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: ChildofFather on August 11, 2016, 02:49:50 PM
First, it is rich in resources and greedy, powerful men plotted how to keep it for themselves. There is a lot of land left to discover and with so much land mass
Under an FE model nobody can possibly extract resources from Antarctica, let alone get there in the first place.

Second, after the moon hoax
[citation needed]

Stopped reading right there buddy. You think the moon landings was faked? Then why can I bounce a laser off of a mirror that humans placed upon the moon and get a result back?

Ummmm...there are no laser's that can reach the moon...lol. Nice try though.

Like most flat earthers you just come out with totally unsubstantiated statements. There were radar measurements as early as 1957.
Quote from: Wikipedia
Lunar Distance, Radar
An experiment was conducted in 1957 at the U.S. Naval Research Laboratory that used the echo from radar signals to determine the Earth-Moon distance. Radar pulses lasting 2 µs were broadcast from a 50 ft diameter radio dish. After the radio waves echoed off the surface of the Moon, the return signal was detected and the delay time measured. From that measurement, the distance could be calculated. In practice, however, the signal-to-noise ratio was so low that an accurate measurement could not be reliably produced.

The experiment was repeated in 1958 at the Royal Radar Establishment, in England. Radar pulses lasting 5 µs were transmitted with a peak power of 2 megawatts, at a repetition rate of 260 pulses per second. After the radio waves echoed off the surface of the Moon, the return signal was detected and the delay time measured. Multiple signals were added together to obtain a reliable signal by superimposing oscilloscope traces onto photographic film. From the measurements, the distance was calculated with an uncertainty of 1.25 km.

These initial experiments were intended to be proof-of-concept experiments and only lasted one day. Follow-on experiments lasting one month produced a mean value of 384402±1.2 km, which was the most accurate measurement of the lunar distance at the time.
From Lunar distance (astronomy) Radar (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lunar_distance_(astronomy)#Radar)

And there were laser's that could reach the moon in 1962 - yes even before the lunar landings.
Quote from: Wikipedia
Lunar Laser Ranging experiment
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
The first successful tests were carried out in 1962 when a team from the Massachusetts Institute of Technology succeeded in observing laser pulses reflected from moon's surface using a laser with a millisecond pulse length. Similar measurements were obtained later the same year by a Soviet team at the Crimean Astrophysical Observatory using a Q-switched ruby laser. Greater accuracy was achieved following the installation of a retroreflector array on July 21, 1969, by the crew of Apollo 11, and two more retroreflector arrays left by the Apollo 14 and Apollo 15 missions have also contributed to the experiment. Successful lunar laser range measurements to the retroreflectors were first reported by the 3.1 m telescope at Lick Observatory, Air Force Cambridge Research Laboratories Lunar Ranging Observatory in Arizona, the Pic du Midi Observatory in France, the Tokyo Astronomical Observatory, and McDonald Observatory in Texas.

You must really enjoy all these conspiracies you go in for.  :) Still, if it keeps you happy!  :)
And you believe everything  your told. Have a nice day!
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: Nightsky on August 11, 2016, 03:19:43 PM
The government is promoting the message of the devil.

The round earth is a message of the devil.

Therefore the gods I know exist are of the flat earth...

The truth.


First of all, Church itself never said Earth is Flat.
They said it is Static.
And those are two different things.

Globe Earth was accepted more than 2000 years ago, when Disc Earth model was abandoned as useless and flawed.
It was LONG BEFORE NASA and other space agencies in the world.

God told us to be fruitful / fertile and multiply.
He is guiding us STEP by STEP, when our mind is ready for it.
He said "repopulate the Earth" and He knew we will overpopulate and need to spread to other planets.

Space agencies are trying to allow us to spread throughout the Universe.
If we live all in the same planet, the next big asteroid will kill us all.
Who will carry on the God's Word?

Denying example with dinosaurs won't make it disappear.

So, which one is REAL "message from the Devil"?
The one that encourages us to spread throughout the Universe?
Or the one that sabbotages space agencies and tries to keep us all in single planet?

I'd say the one that concentrates us all into same risk.

"Earth is flat, don't go, let's all die together."

And Church really never said the Earth is Flat.

Very trippy.....
Wow I thought this was supposed to be a FE site not some God shop. 
What a heady combination Flat earth and sky faeries...wow


Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: Space Cowgirl on August 12, 2016, 11:36:11 AM
The government is hiding the flat earth from us so they can play with fire.

(https://66.media.tumblr.com/d03075e0cfb5ed04df3aa8c642bbdb32/tumblr_obm5yh1WQj1qaityko1_540.gif)

Wow that's an awesome .gif

I don't have time to find it at the moment, but I think that was NASA (the devil) testing a new camera. I'll see if I can find it later.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: neutrino on August 12, 2016, 03:40:26 PM
cowgirl, you look like a little angel on your avatar. What makes you think that NASA is devil?
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: Space Cowgirl on August 12, 2016, 03:54:27 PM
And you look like outer space on your avatar, how is it that you can type?

@TheRealBillNye (and anyone else interested in that NASA gif) http://www.nasa.gov/feature/revolutionary-camera-recording-propulsion-data-completes-groundbreaking-test 

Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: JRoweSkeptic on August 12, 2016, 05:37:37 PM
"It's your model!"
Let me know when you can deduce the measurements of your Earth from theory alone.

"Look, we know the size and shapes of all continents and countries.
We know the circumference of equator of the real earth (globe, flat or egg-shaped).
We know the distance from the equator to the North or South Pole."
How? Don't just say "We do!" or "People found it!" What people measured the exact distance, and how are you assured of its reliability given the terrain that would inevitably be part of such a journey?
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: SpJunk on August 12, 2016, 09:05:16 PM
...

"Look, we know the size and shapes of all continents and countries.
We know the circumference of equator of the real earth (globe, flat or egg-shaped).
We know the distance from the equator to the North or South Pole."
How? Don't just say "We do!" or "People found it!" What people measured the exact distance, and how are you assured of its reliability given the terrain that would inevitably be part of such a journey?

What do you mean "what people"?

So many people do Geodesy, so many people do Navigation, so many people do Astronomy, ...
How to list their names?

But I "know" at least some of them are competitive, and if someone would make erroneous claims
the competitive ones would immediately jump against and say "it is wrong, I know better".
(I'm 55 y/o and I believe that by now I know at least something about human nature.)

Since in main premisses things like that don't happen any more, I tend to mostly believe them.

~~~~~

Why I mentioned those people and fields?

This is why:

Do you know how long is Nautical Mile, and why is it longer than Statute Mile?
How is it defined?

Do you know how is measured one minute of latitude?
Know something of Geodesy and Triangulation?
How theodolite works, how is it used, how is error calculated, ... ?

Do you know how to use sextant, what is Apparent Horizon Dip
and why is it important for accuracy?

For example, see Al-Biruni here:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_geodesy (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_geodesy)

And here Eratostenes made mistake of just 145 miles, or 0.58%:
http://oceanservice.noaa.gov/education/kits/geodesy/geo02_histr.html (http://oceanservice.noaa.gov/education/kits/geodesy/geo02_histr.html)
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: ChildofFather on August 12, 2016, 10:12:46 PM

Ummmm...there are no laser's that can reach the moon...lol. Nice try though.

Visit the Apache Point observatory, they have a laser, which beam does not only go to the moon, but does also come back.
McDonalds Observatory also has laser.

Looks like the try is even "nicer" than you thought. :-)

Must be an illusion. It's impossible.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: Aliveandkicking on August 12, 2016, 11:51:44 PM
"It's your model!"
Let me know when you can deduce the measurements of your Earth from theory alone.

"Look, we know the size and shapes of all continents and countries.
We know the circumference of equator of the real earth (globe, flat or egg-shaped).
We know the distance from the equator to the North or South Pole."
How? Don't just say "We do!" or "People found it!" What people measured the exact distance, and how are you assured of its reliability given the terrain that would inevitably be part of such a journey?



Nobody needs to know exact distances to compute the shape of the Earth, because theoretical flat earth distances are massively different to round Earth distances by thousands of miles..  VERY rough approximations are sufficient. 

 As far as continents go these have actually been measured with a tape measure and surveyors form of a protractor.  Today distances are measured electronically using speed of light calculations.

Even distances measured by ships or submarines can be relied upon because over sufficient time,  journey times for the same ship will correlate to the distance travelled over the water.

So not surprisingly there are no flat earth maps which make any sense at all.

Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: TheRealBillNye on August 13, 2016, 01:29:56 AM

Ummmm...there are no laser's that can reach the moon...lol. Nice try though.

Visit the Apache Point observatory, they have a laser, which beam does not only go to the moon, but does also come back.
McDonalds Observatory also has laser.

Looks like the try is even "nicer" than you thought. :-)

Must be an illusion. It's impossible.

This evidence disagrees with my worldview, ergo IT MUST BE PART OF THE CONSPIRACY

FE logic never ceases to amaze
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: johnnyorbital on August 13, 2016, 01:56:36 AM

Ummmm...there are no laser's that can reach the moon...lol. Nice try though.

Visit the Apache Point observatory, they have a laser, which beam does not only go to the moon, but does also come back.
McDonalds Observatory also has laser.

Looks like the try is even "nicer" than you thought. :-)

Must be an illusion. It's impossible.

It's scientifically proven, therefore its fact, again, we did this test in college, if you aim wrong, the laser doesn't return.. disproving it being the dome, and disproving the moon is reflective all over

its been tried and tested


its funny how religious FE's ask for evidence and claim things must be an illusion.. how about proving angels are anything other than aliens? the Bible states they 'came from the sky', well any 'beings' who come from anywhere but earth are classed as extraterrestrials right?
How about proving noah lived to 800yrs old, or that Jesus walked on water?

asking for evidence is an insult, us globe earthers provide irrefutable evidence that still gets dismissed with one word answers by religious types.. but they fail to answer why all religions tell the same basic story, jesus, buddha, horus, dionyses, Krishna (and many many more) all born 25th december, of a virgin birth, star in the east, 12 followers, died on a cross, dead for 3 days, resurrected etc etc

I'm not asking you to explain all this, I've done my research, the answers are obvious.. I'm simply pointing out the irony in you, being religious, asking us for evidence, claiming something is impossible so it must be an illusion, when the same can be done with the most part of religious books
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: JRoweSkeptic on August 13, 2016, 11:02:26 AM
"Nobody needs to know exact distances to compute the shape of the Earth, because theoretical flat earth distances are massively different to round Earth distances by thousands of miles..  VERY rough approximations are sufficient. "
DET reduces the error.

And as per usual, no one provides sources of measurements or how they have determined accuracy. Just swift evasion and spjunk rather obviously trying to change the topic.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: gyrex on August 13, 2016, 12:07:18 PM
DET reduces the error.

So, all that means is that there's still an error with your DET model.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: Son of Orospu on August 13, 2016, 05:05:00 PM

Ummmm...there are no laser's that can reach the moon...lol. Nice try though.

Visit the Apache Point observatory, they have a laser, which beam does not only go to the moon, but does also come back.
McDonalds Observatory also has laser.

Looks like the try is even "nicer" than you thought. :-)

Must be an illusion. It's impossible.

It's scientifically proven, therefore its fact, again, we did this test in college, if you aim wrong, the laser doesn't return.. disproving it being the dome, and disproving the moon is reflective all over

its been tried and tested


its funny how religious FE's ask for evidence and claim things must be an illusion.. how about proving angels are anything other than aliens? the Bible states they 'came from the sky', well any 'beings' who come from anywhere but earth are classed as extraterrestrials right?
How about proving noah lived to 800yrs old, or that Jesus walked on water?

asking for evidence is an insult, us globe earthers provide irrefutable evidence that still gets dismissed with one word answers by religious types.. but they fail to answer why all religions tell the same basic story, jesus, buddha, horus, dionyses, Krishna (and many many more) all born 25th december, of a virgin birth, star in the east, 12 followers, died on a cross, dead for 3 days, resurrected etc etc

I'm not asking you to explain all this, I've done my research, the answers are obvious.. I'm simply pointing out the irony in you, being religious, asking us for evidence, claiming something is impossible so it must be an illusion, when the same can be done with the most part of religious books

What is kind of funny is that you have been explained to, by a roundy none the less, that we have been bouncing lasers off the moon since 1962, long before we supposedly littered the planet with reflectors, yet you still insist that it somehow proves the shape of the Earth.   :-\
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: johnnyorbital on August 14, 2016, 01:20:48 AM

Ummmm...there are no laser's that can reach the moon...lol. Nice try though.

Visit the Apache Point observatory, they have a laser, which beam does not only go to the moon, but does also come back.
McDonalds Observatory also has laser.

Looks like the try is even "nicer" than you thought. :-)

Must be an illusion. It's impossible.

It's scientifically proven, therefore its fact, again, we did this test in college, if you aim wrong, the laser doesn't return.. disproving it being the dome, and disproving the moon is reflective all over

its been tried and tested


its funny how religious FE's ask for evidence and claim things must be an illusion.. how about proving angels are anything other than aliens? the Bible states they 'came from the sky', well any 'beings' who come from anywhere but earth are classed as extraterrestrials right?
How about proving noah lived to 800yrs old, or that Jesus walked on water?

asking for evidence is an insult, us globe earthers provide irrefutable evidence that still gets dismissed with one word answers by religious types.. but they fail to answer why all religions tell the same basic story, jesus, buddha, horus, dionyses, Krishna (and many many more) all born 25th december, of a virgin birth, star in the east, 12 followers, died on a cross, dead for 3 days, resurrected etc etc

I'm not asking you to explain all this, I've done my research, the answers are obvious.. I'm simply pointing out the irony in you, being religious, asking us for evidence, claiming something is impossible so it must be an illusion, when the same can be done with the most part of religious books

What is kind of funny is that you have been explained to, by a roundy none the less, that we have been bouncing lasers off the moon since 1962, long before we supposedly littered the planet with reflectors, yet you still insist that it somehow proves the shape of the Earth.   :-\

1. I never once claimed it proved any shape
2. The difference in the accuracy proves the difference between the '62 tests.. BOTH prove the distance is nowhere near the FE claims

3. You're terrible at this
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: JRoweSkeptic on August 14, 2016, 09:36:06 AM
"So, all that means is that there's still an error with your DET model."
No, it means DET reduces the error. It is possible to reduce something to zero. I admit that the uniplanar map has obvious flaws that cannot easily be explained away, but you should also admit that any means of measurement feature error. If you can provide and verify distances that falsify DET, I'll listen, but the key word there is verify. Don't just say "It's wrong!" or "These distances are accurate!" A lot of the larger scales distances of relevance are typically calculated by the assumption of a Round Earth, and are too large to be easily verified or tested by everyday people.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: gyrex on August 14, 2016, 10:03:48 AM
Ummmm...there are no laser's that can reach the moon...lol. Nice try though.

Wrong. There's a long range laser ranging facility at Wettzell, Germany which is capable of reaching the moon (https://www.bkg.bund.de/DE/Observatorium-Wettzell/Messsysteme-Wettzell/Wettzell-Laser-Ranging-System/wettzell-laser-ranging-system.html) - use google translate. You can go there yourself and see it in action.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: ChildofFather on August 14, 2016, 11:52:08 AM
Ummmm...there are no laser's that can reach the moon...lol. Nice try though.

Wrong. There's a long range laser ranging facility at Wettzell, Germany which is capable of reaching the moon (https://www.bkg.bund.de/DE/Observatorium-Wettzell/Messsysteme-Wettzell/Wettzell-Laser-Ranging-System/wettzell-laser-ranging-system.html) - use google translate. You can go there yourself and see it in action.

Yet we still don't have comercial visits to space. Makes no sense. None of what they do makes sense. Everything is marketed for money but space!?! BS, it stinks to much to be true.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: gyrex on August 14, 2016, 02:48:45 PM

Wrong. There's a long range laser ranging facility at Wettzell, Germany which is capable of reaching the moon (https://www.bkg.bund.de/DE/Observatorium-Wettzell/Messsysteme-Wettzell/Wettzell-Laser-Ranging-System/wettzell-laser-ranging-system.html) - use google translate. You can go there yourself and see it in action.

Yet we still don't have comercial visits to space. Makes no sense. None of what they do makes sense. Everything is marketed for money but space!?! BS, it stinks to much to be true.

Sorry, I don't understand the connection between long range lasers and commercial space visits? I don't really understand the rest of your post. None of what who do makes sense? What connection are you making between marketing and space?
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: SpJunk on August 15, 2016, 09:49:27 PM
"Nobody needs to know exact distances to compute the shape of the Earth, because theoretical flat earth distances are massively different to round Earth distances by thousands of miles..  VERY rough approximations are sufficient. "
DET reduces the error.

And as per usual, no one provides sources of measurements or how they have determined accuracy. Just swift evasion and spjunk rather obviously trying to change the topic.

Gave you sources of measurement.

Measurement started with Aristotle and his 45 000 miles, continued with Eratostenes and his 25 000 miles,
till modern Geodesy that measured 40 000 km around equator, and 10 000 km from equator to pole.

So, what shape can fit equatorial circle of 40 000 km with pole-to-equator distance of 10 000 km?

Cone?

And for topic, I absolutely agree with you. My mistake.

~~~~~

Government is hiding Flat Earth from us, because it is still under construction, and it is not safe to go there.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: Cartog on August 16, 2016, 02:21:00 PM
There are most certainly lasers whose beams can reach the moon, as was shown as far back as 1969 with the first moon landing.  The astronauts set up a retroflector - a sort of parabolic mirror that has to be aimed very precisely so that any laser beam coming from the Earth will be reflected to its source -  and it was immediately demonstrated to have worked - one of the ways that we know that the astronauts were really there.  All the moon landings set up retroflectors and they are the only equipment still working.

There are other threads on this forum asking why the govt (I should think "every government that has existed anywhere for the last 500 years") is denying the flatness of the Earth.  The usual FE answer is "money".  Just that.  Nobody explains how lying about the shape of the earth generates money.   There is also the explanation that a Round Earth encourages a belief in evolution .... but there were people who believed in a round earth for a thousand years before Darwin thought up evolution, and even now there are people who will vehemently deny evolution yet insist the earth is round.  Also some notion that a round earth encourages "sun worship" -- I've met literally thousands of people who believed the earth was round and literally zero who worshipped the sun.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: Physicsteacher on August 16, 2016, 02:26:27 PM
Nobody on this forum believes in flat earth
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: gyrex on August 16, 2016, 02:52:27 PM
Nobody on this forum believes in flat earth

I'd agree with this statement.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: rabinoz on August 16, 2016, 03:22:46 PM
Back to the OP again: "Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?"

Put bluntly, no government has any interest in "hiding the flat earth from us".

There are an almost innumerable number of people working in areas where in the course of their daily jobs they need to know the true shape of the earth. This is a link I made to an earlier post on this thread Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us? « Reply #46 on: August 10, 2016, 05:14:53 AM » (https://www.theflatearthsociety.org/forum/index.php?topic=67617.msg1808676#msg1808676).

And I challenge anyone to come up with real evidence that they do!
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: JRoweSkeptic on August 16, 2016, 04:08:08 PM
"Measurement started with Aristotle and his 45 000 miles, continued with Eratostenes and his 25 000 miles,
till modern Geodesy that measured 40 000 km around equator, and 10 000 km from equator to pole."
So, measurements made by assuming the world is a ball, beyond "measurements are just made." Great job there.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: rabinoz on August 16, 2016, 05:12:42 PM
"Measurement started with Aristotle and his 45 000 miles, continued with Eratostenes and his 25 000 miles,
till modern Geodesy that measured 40 000 km around equator, and 10 000 km from equator to pole."
So, measurements made by assuming the world is a ball, beyond "measurements are just made." Great job there.

We could look in
Quote from: the Wiki
Finding your Latitude and Longitude

Latitude
To locate your latitude on the Flat Earth, it's important to know the following fact: The degrees of the Earth's Latitude are based upon the angle of the sun in the sky at noon equinox.

That's why 0˚ N/S sits on the equator where the sun is directly overhead, and why 90˚ N/S sits at the poles where the sun is at a right angle to the observer. At 45 North or South from the equator, the sun will sit at an angle 45˚ in the sky. The angle of the sun past zenith is our latitude.

Knowing that as you recede North or South from the equator at equinox, the sun will descend at a pace of one degree per 69.5 miles, we can even derive our distance from the equator based upon the position of the sun in the sky.

Longitude
To find your longitude you just need to know how many hours apart you are from Greenwich, UK and a vertical stick to know when the sun is at its zenith over your present location.

To calculate the distance from the equator to either pole to the equator we use this bit "Knowing that as you recede North or South from the equator at equinox, the sun will descend at a pace of one degree per 69.5 miles, we can even derive our distance from the equator based upon the position of the sun in the sky."

So the distance from the equator to either pole is 90˚ x 69.5 miles = 6,225 miles, pretty close as the current figure is 6215 miles (to the nearest mile).

The Wiki does not explain so explicitly about the degree of longitude, but does say "to find your longitude you just need to know how many hours apart you are from Greenwich". The implication from this is simply that the flat earth sun rotates at a constant angular velocity as it circles around the north pole.
In other words. a degree of longitude (at a given latitude) is the same all around the earth.

So, if we know the length of one degree of longitude at the equator we can find the equatorial circumference,

Here I have to admit I cannot, yet, find any explicit measurements of a degree of longitude at the equator, but there are references to finding the earth's radius,
such as this tenth century one Al-Biruni's Classic Experiment: How to Calculate the Radius of the Earth? (https://owlcation.com/stem/How-to-Determin-the-Radius-of-the-Earth-Al-Birunis-Classic-Experiment). Al Biruni measured the earth's curvature from the dip angle to the horizon[1].

I will keep looking.

But, if you want to suggest that, at the equator the degree of longitude is not 69 miles, you will have a fight on your hands with every mapmaker and navigator.


[1]  This of course, contradicts the FE claim of the horizon rising to eye-level!
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: JRoweSkeptic on August 17, 2016, 03:21:47 PM
"But, if you want to suggest that, at the equator the degree of longitude is not 69 miles, you will have a fight on your hands with every mapmaker and navigator."
Most of them think the world is round, I'll have a fight on my hands with them regardless.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: rabinoz on August 17, 2016, 11:55:35 PM
"But, if you want to suggest that, at the equator the degree of longitude is not 69 miles, you will have a fight on your hands with every mapmaker and navigator."
Most of them think the world is round, I'll have a fight on my hands with them regardless.

Don't you think that since navigators
have to guide ships and aircraft to places on the real earth that they might be the ones who would know shape of the real earth?

Electronic navigational aids Decca, Loran and GPS were not always around, before that they had to rely on dead reckoning and celestial navigation, even in flying aircraft.

This is Kingsford Smith's route from USA to Australia in 1928.
(http://monumentaustralia.org.au/content/directory/full/Kingsford_Smith_Flight_Path-3658-90863.)
Just give a thought to navigating over that route from Oakland, CA to Brisbane, QLD in 1928, landing only at Hawaii, Fiji and Brisbane.

You would have be confident that the distances were correct and flat earth distances (and navigation directions), even on your DET, are quite different from on the globe.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: SpJunk on August 18, 2016, 11:10:41 PM
"Measurement started with Aristotle and his 45 000 miles, continued with Eratostenes and his 25 000 miles,
till modern Geodesy that measured 40 000 km around equator, and 10 000 km from equator to pole."
So, measurements made by assuming the world is a ball, beyond "measurements are just made." Great job there.

"Assuming" ???

Did you ever hear of sextant? Don't tell me you didn't.
Do you know what is Apparent Horizon Dip, and why it is important?
Do you know how navigators calculated position at sea?
Based on what? Why it worked?

Did you ever hear of theodolite? Also, don't tell me you didn't.
Do you know any part of Earth not measured by geodesists?
Did they "assume" or measure all angles and distances?
Do you even know what is triangulation?
Also, do you know why big enough triangles measured on Earth's surface are non-Euclidean triangles?

Do you have to "assume" anything when you can measure it in real life?

Why they made that big Geodesic expedition in Peru?

"French minister of the navy understood that it was necessary to know the exact
shape of Earth in order to accurately navigate the oceans."
Why is navigation so accurate if they were wrong?

(From: THIS ARTICLE (http://www.popularmechanics.com/science/environment/a6674/the-remarkable-story-of-the-first-accurate-measure-of-the-earth/).)

...
Most of them think the world is round, I'll have a fight on my hands with them regardless.

What do you think why they think it?
Maybe because they saw measurements?
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: Thanos on August 19, 2016, 01:45:56 PM
However, what are the potential motives that "the man" has, as far as keeping the truth about Flat Earth a secret goes?

Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: Cartog on August 20, 2016, 07:17:34 PM
I would daresay that a lot of scientists consider it their duty to reveal the truth without regard to whether people find it depressing or amusing.  In fact, the revelation of a dome would probably start an entirely new science and industry to try to drill through it.  I am not sure how a FE indicates limited resources more than a RE but proof of a FE might invigorate new science and industry to explore over the edge - for all we know there are resources - and maybe even forms of life - beyond the edge (or beyond the dome).

And it's a simple economic fact that there's not enough money to go around to bribe everyone to keep quiet about a FE.  Do you honestly think the severely underpaid teachers and professors around the world are being secretly bribed??  At the same moment, if there were any truth to a FE, the one scientist who first reveals it to the world would be assured of money, fame, and pretty lab assistants!  Isn't that sufficient motivation?
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: Thanos on August 20, 2016, 11:06:47 PM
I would daresay that a lot of scientists consider it their duty to reveal the truth without regard to whether people find it depressing or amusing.  In fact, the revelation of a dome would probably start an entirely new science and industry to try to drill through it.  I am not sure how a FE indicates limited resources more than a RE but proof of a FE might invigorate new science and industry to explore over the edge - for all we know there are resources - and maybe even forms of life - beyond the edge (or beyond the dome).

And it's a simple economic fact that there's not enough money to go around to bribe everyone to keep quiet about a FE.  Do you honestly think the severely underpaid teachers and professors around the world are being secretly bribed??  At the same moment, if there were any truth to a FE, the one scientist who first reveals it to the world would be assured of money, fame, and pretty lab assistants!  Isn't that sufficient motivation?

There are also lots of scientists who are bound by non-disclosure agreements to never disclosure research details for various reasons.  Agreements which have severe loss of career consequences if breached. In reality that first scientist would get punished like Edward Snowden and Chelsa Manning.

Also a lot of science, industry, and military efforts seem to be attempts to break out of the dome.  Both the USA and USSR tried nuking the dome with countless atmosphere tests in the 60s-70s, Russia tried drilling past 8 miles underground, and Japan is trying to make a 10 petawatt  laser that will concentrate the equivalent of the entire world's electricity consumption times 10,000.

No, it is not an economic fact. It is just a cliched slogan and your opinion.  Are you not aware that National Central banks create currency out of thin air for their respective governments?  Also there are huge pension slush funds for government employees and teachers all over the world.  The CalPERS structure isn't limited to just Calfornia it has been implemented globally. So I completely disagree with the sentiment that there just isn't enough money to bribe so many people.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: John87 on September 07, 2016, 01:24:51 PM
There are also lots of scientists who are bound by non-disclosure agreements to never disclosure research details for various reasons.  Agreements which have severe loss of career consequences if breached. In reality that first scientist would get punished like Edward Snowden and Chelsa Manning.

Also a lot of science, industry, and military efforts seem to be attempts to break out of the dome.  Both the USA and USSR tried nuking the dome with countless atmosphere tests in the 60s-70s, Russia tried drilling past 8 miles underground, and Japan is trying to make a 10 petawatt  laser that will concentrate the equivalent of the entire world's electricity consumption times 10,000.

No, it is not an economic fact. It is just a cliched slogan and your opinion.  Are you not aware that National Central banks create currency out of thin air for their respective governments?  Also there are huge pension slush funds for government employees and teachers all over the world.  The CalPERS structure isn't limited to just Calfornia it has been implemented globally. So I completely disagree with the sentiment that there just isn't enough money to bribe so many people.

There is no dome and you have no proof of it.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: Cartog on September 08, 2016, 06:27:48 AM
Non-disclosure agreements:  This supposes that a scientist is/was hired or under contract to someone, which usually happens AFTER he has attained some experience as a scientist.  But we have lots and lots of scientists, all around the world, and in previous decades and centuries, that were not under any contract.  And yet they also all held to a Round Earth.  And I am sure that every one of them knew that the first one to prove the "true flatness" would get fame and fortune and the cute lab assistants.  Do you really believe that ALL scientists, everywhere on earth, for the past four or more centuries, were crooked and were being paid off??

Not to be catty, but your grasp of economics is as simplistic as your attitude about scientists.  Money is not made out of thin air.  In the US, it is necessary that the Federal Reserve purchase Treasury bonds in order to issue an equivalent amount of currency.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: Thanos on September 08, 2016, 05:22:53 PM
There is no dome and you have no proof of it.

*Yawns* Not an argument.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: Thanos on September 08, 2016, 07:09:35 PM
Non-disclosure agreements:  This supposes that a scientist is/was hired or under contract to someone, which usually happens AFTER he has attained some experience as a scientist.  But we have lots and lots of scientists, all around the world, and in previous decades and centuries, that were not under any contract.  And yet they also all held to a Round Earth.  And I am sure that every one of them knew that the first one to prove the "true flatness" would get fame and fortune and the cute lab assistants.  Do you really believe that ALL scientists, everywhere on earth, for the past four or more centuries, were crooked and were being paid off??

Not to be catty, but your grasp of economics is as simplistic as your attitude about scientists.  Money is not made out of thin air.  In the US, it is necessary that the Federal Reserve purchase Treasury bonds in order to issue an equivalent amount of currency.

No, not every scientist held to a Round Earth model. Most notably Auguste Piccard, the first scientist to see the earth from the stratosphere, described the earth as a flat disc with an upturned edge. 

No, it is just your fantastical opinion and confirmation bias that such a scientist would be rewarded with fame, riches, and pretty women. 

No, I never implied that ALL scientists were crooked and paid for. Shame on you for trying to twist my argument with such dishonest rhetorical questioning.

That is a very ignorant and ineffective economic argument. Treasury bonds are paper IOUs with fiat digits on them just like the Federal Reserve Notes they are exchanged for. This exchange process of fiat paper for another form of fiat paper just further proves my point that currency is printed out of thin air.  Also your completely silent about the pension fund structures that provides financial incentives to every scientist and teacher on government and public education tenure.  The pension funds alone annihilate your naive opinion on there not being enough money to provide incentive to silence.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: zork on September 09, 2016, 12:32:08 AM
No, not every scientist held to a Round Earth model. Most notably Auguste Piccard, the first scientist to see the earth from the stratosphere, described the earth as a flat disc with an upturned edge. 
  He described the view he saw. And you come and make up lie that he didn't held to Round Earth model.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: -leigh- on September 09, 2016, 06:08:19 AM
because there hiding the devil simply assss
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: Cartog on September 10, 2016, 02:54:08 PM
I looked up as much as I could of Auguste Piccard and he evidently did not believe that the planet was shaped flat.  He merely described the view from a Montgolfier balloon, which is pretty much like the view from the Observation Deck of the Empire State Building.  The intriguing thing is, wherever you go up in altitude, the earth looks like a disc - which is to say circular - never one side so much closer than the other sides, all the edges equidistant no matter where on earth you take a balloon ride.  That suggests that there is no Edge anywhere, that the earth is a sphere without an edge.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: johnnyorbital on September 11, 2016, 01:36:46 AM
Ummmm...there are no laser's that can reach the moon...lol. Nice try though.

Wrong. There's a long range laser ranging facility at Wettzell, Germany which is capable of reaching the moon (https://www.bkg.bund.de/DE/Observatorium-Wettzell/Messsysteme-Wettzell/Wettzell-Laser-Ranging-System/wettzell-laser-ranging-system.html) - use google translate. You can go there yourself and see it in action.

Yet we still don't have comercial visits to space. Makes no sense. None of what they do makes sense. Everything is marketed for money but space!?! BS, it stinks to much to be true.

yes we do have commercial space visits..

or are the people who have been also paid shills?
the owner of Cirque de Soleil has been into space

do some research

I would daresay that a lot of scientists consider it their duty to reveal the truth without regard to whether people find it depressing or amusing.  In fact, the revelation of a dome would probably start an entirely new science and industry to try to drill through it.  I am not sure how a FE indicates limited resources more than a RE but proof of a FE might invigorate new science and industry to explore over the edge - for all we know there are resources - and maybe even forms of life - beyond the edge (or beyond the dome).

And it's a simple economic fact that there's not enough money to go around to bribe everyone to keep quiet about a FE.  Do you honestly think the severely underpaid teachers and professors around the world are being secretly bribed??  At the same moment, if there were any truth to a FE, the one scientist who first reveals it to the world would be assured of money, fame, and pretty lab assistants!  Isn't that sufficient motivation?

There are also lots of scientists who are bound by non-disclosure agreements to never disclosure research details for various reasons.  Agreements which have severe loss of career consequences if breached. In reality that first scientist would get punished like Edward Snowden and Chelsa Manning.

Also a lot of science, industry, and military efforts seem to be attempts to break out of the dome.  Both the USA and USSR tried nuking the dome with countless atmosphere tests in the 60s-70s, Russia tried drilling past 8 miles underground, and Japan is trying to make a 10 petawatt  laser that will concentrate the equivalent of the entire world's electricity consumption times 10,000.

No, it is not an economic fact. It is just a cliched slogan and your opinion.  Are you not aware that National Central banks create currency out of thin air for their respective governments?  Also there are huge pension slush funds for government employees and teachers all over the world.  The CalPERS structure isn't limited to just Calfornia it has been implemented globally. So I completely disagree with the sentiment that there just isn't enough money to bribe so many people.

the glass/ice dome is disproven by the existence of meteors
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: Thanos on September 11, 2016, 11:24:31 AM
I looked up as much as I could of Auguste Piccard and he evidently did not believe that the planet was shaped flat.  He merely described the view from a Montgolfier balloon, which is pretty much like the view from the Observation Deck of the Empire State Building.  The intriguing thing is, wherever you go up in altitude, the earth looks like a disc - which is to say circular - never one side so much closer than the other sides, all the edges equidistant no matter where on earth you take a balloon ride.  That suggests that there is no Edge anywhere, that the earth is a sphere without an edge.

Or it suggests that balloon passengers at 3,000 ft just aren't close enough to the Antarctic edge. After all they can only see the horizon for 67 miles which is nothing with in the grand scale of the earth's size. 
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: SpJunk on September 11, 2016, 11:39:32 AM
I looked up as much as I could of Auguste Piccard and he evidently did not believe that the planet was shaped flat.  He merely described the view from a Montgolfier balloon, which is pretty much like the view from the Observation Deck of the Empire State Building.  The intriguing thing is, wherever you go up in altitude, the earth looks like a disc - which is to say circular - never one side so much closer than the other sides, all the edges equidistant no matter where on earth you take a balloon ride.  That suggests that there is no Edge anywhere, that the earth is a sphere without an edge.

Or it suggests that balloon passengers at 3,000 ft just aren't close enough to the Antarctic edge. After all they can only see the horizon for 67 miles which is nothing with in the grand scale of the earth's size.

Why only 67 miles from 3000 feet if the Earth is flat?
What hides the rest, say, 120 miles away?
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: Thanos on September 11, 2016, 01:39:53 PM
I looked up as much as I could of Auguste Piccard and he evidently did not believe that the planet was shaped flat.  He merely described the view from a Montgolfier balloon, which is pretty much like the view from the Observation Deck of the Empire State Building.  The intriguing thing is, wherever you go up in altitude, the earth looks like a disc - which is to say circular - never one side so much closer than the other sides, all the edges equidistant no matter where on earth you take a balloon ride.  That suggests that there is no Edge anywhere, that the earth is a sphere without an edge.

Or it suggests that balloon passengers at 3,000 ft just aren't close enough to the Antarctic edge. After all they can only see the horizon for 67 miles which is nothing with in the grand scale of the earth's size.

Why only 67 miles from 3000 feet if the Earth is flat?
What hides the rest, say, 120 miles away?

The limits of perspective for the observer is the same regardless of the shape.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: Thanos on September 11, 2016, 02:03:06 PM
Ummmm...there are no laser's that can reach the moon...lol. Nice try though.

Wrong. There's a long range laser ranging facility at Wettzell, Germany which is capable of reaching the moon (https://www.bkg.bund.de/DE/Observatorium-Wettzell/Messsysteme-Wettzell/Wettzell-Laser-Ranging-System/wettzell-laser-ranging-system.html) - use google translate. You can go there yourself and see it in action.

Yet we still don't have comercial visits to space. Makes no sense. None of what they do makes sense. Everything is marketed for money but space!?! BS, it stinks to much to be true.

yes we do have commercial space visits..

or are the people who have been also paid shills?
the owner of Cirque de Soleil has been into space

do some research

I would daresay that a lot of scientists consider it their duty to reveal the truth without regard to whether people find it depressing or amusing.  In fact, the revelation of a dome would probably start an entirely new science and industry to try to drill through it.  I am not sure how a FE indicates limited resources more than a RE but proof of a FE might invigorate new science and industry to explore over the edge - for all we know there are resources - and maybe even forms of life - beyond the edge (or beyond the dome).

And it's a simple economic fact that there's not enough money to go around to bribe everyone to keep quiet about a FE.  Do you honestly think the severely underpaid teachers and professors around the world are being secretly bribed??  At the same moment, if there were any truth to a FE, the one scientist who first reveals it to the world would be assured of money, fame, and pretty lab assistants!  Isn't that sufficient motivation?

There are also lots of scientists who are bound by non-disclosure agreements to never disclosure research details for various reasons.  Agreements which have severe loss of career consequences if breached. In reality that first scientist would get punished like Edward Snowden and Chelsa Manning.

Also a lot of science, industry, and military efforts seem to be attempts to break out of the dome.  Both the USA and USSR tried nuking the dome with countless atmosphere tests in the 60s-70s, Russia tried drilling past 8 miles underground, and Japan is trying to make a 10 petawatt  laser that will concentrate the equivalent of the entire world's electricity consumption times 10,000.

No, it is not an economic fact. It is just a cliched slogan and your opinion.  Are you not aware that National Central banks create currency out of thin air for their respective governments?  Also there are huge pension slush funds for government employees and teachers all over the world.  The CalPERS structure isn't limited to just Calfornia it has been implemented globally. So I completely disagree with the sentiment that there just isn't enough money to bribe so many people.

the glass/ice dome is disproven by the existence of meteors

Even billionaires like Elon Musk and the owner of Cirque de Soleil are middle class compared to the banking dynasties that run the UN.

Never said the dome was glass/ice. Personally I think the dome is a type of energy barrier. Meteorites maybe be able to fall into it, but we can't send rockets out of the dome.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: Thanos on September 11, 2016, 04:15:18 PM
its not the goverment its the zionist jews who own them,every one of them

By zionist jews do you mean the Rothschild dynasty?  The Rothschilds answer to the far more ancient Vatican bank. The Vatican bank assigned the Rothschild bloodline as frontmen to their mafia operations so that they could take advantage of prejudices and play the “just blame the jew” card whenever their corrupt crime rings were exposed.




   
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: johnnyorbital on September 12, 2016, 01:01:29 AM
where's your evidence for your claim?

you're actually kind of correct, it is an energy barrier, protecting us from the sun

nothing comes in or out though? That's wrong, we can track meteors and there's artifacts ON the moon that humans left there

you can't just say the reflector test doesn't exist, I've personally seen it work
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: Thanos on September 12, 2016, 07:35:17 PM
where's your evidence for your claim?

you're actually kind of correct, it is an energy barrier, protecting us from the sun

nothing comes in or out though? That's wrong, we can track meteors and there's artifacts ON the moon that humans left there

you can't just say the reflector test doesn't exist, I've personally seen it work


There were numerous attempts to nuke the dome in "operation fishbowl" with rockets and the highest they ever got was 680 miles. Since the fake Moon landings astronauts have only been traveling within 400 miles.

I clearly said "Meteorites maybe be able to fall into it, but we can't send rockets out of the dome."  I think the dome is there mainly to trap us the inhabitants of earth. Like a giant roach motel it may let physical objects fall in though the top, but it won't let us leave.  After all we seem to be valuable livestock to whom or whatever constructed the dome, and ranchers don't just let cattle wonder outside their fenced property.

 The reflector test can easily be explained by the fact that some parts of the moon are more reflective then others.  We also have more powerful and precise lasers now then we did when MIT first did reflective tests on the moon in the 1950s.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: Crouton on September 12, 2016, 08:31:11 PM
where's your evidence for your claim?

you're actually kind of correct, it is an energy barrier, protecting us from the sun

nothing comes in or out though? That's wrong, we can track meteors and there's artifacts ON the moon that humans left there

you can't just say the reflector test doesn't exist, I've personally seen it work

 The reflector test can easily be explained by the fact that some parts of the moon are more reflective then others.  We also have more powerful and precise lasers now then we did when MIT first did reflective tests on the moon in the 1950s.

Not quite.  You would have to find a part of the moon that isn't just more reflective but a natural formation that acts like a retroreflector https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Retroreflector. 
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: Crouton on September 12, 2016, 08:36:49 PM
Oh, and here's a video detailing it if you don't like reading(who does?). 

Pay attention to the "retro" part of retroreflector.  Very important difference.

Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: rabinoz on September 13, 2016, 01:27:13 AM
There were numerous attempts to nuke the dome in "operation fishbowl" with rockets and the highest they ever got was 680 miles. Since the fake Moon landings astronauts have only been traveling within 400 miles.

I clearly said "Meteorites maybe be able to fall into it, but we can't send rockets out of the dome."  I think the dome is there mainly to trap us the inhabitants of earth. Like a giant roach motel it may let physical objects fall in though the top, but it won't let us leave.  After all we seem to be valuable livestock to whom or whatever constructed the dome, and ranchers don't just let cattle wonder outside their fenced property.

What about a little actual evidence for your claims.

Sure "You clearly said 'Meteorites maybe be able to fall into it, but we can't send rockets out of the dome.'  I think the dome is there mainly to trap us the inhabitants of earth."

You say "maybe" and "I think", but that's not any sort of evidence that "we can't send rockets out of the dome".
That's all just springs out of your conspiracy infected mind.

You reject out of hand all evidence to the contrary about satellites etc, though I suppose the ISS is Ok since it's only 200 to 400 miles up.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: Cartog on September 15, 2016, 05:24:15 PM
Gee, it was tough enough to imagine that the Earth was flat.  Adding to that the notion that we are all under some sort of bell jar is just too much.

Who built this bell jar?  What's it made of?  How come meteorites come in yet there's no evidence of this bell jar breaking or even chipping?  How come there's no reflection or other optic evidence of it?  Who keeps it clean and where do they get all the Windex for it?  And, most important, how come nobody has ever bumped into it, considering it ought to be in every direction if you go far enough?

Seems to me that bumping into that bell jar would incite an entirely new and thriving science and industry to analyze the substance of the bell jar, drill through it, explore beyond it, etc.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: John Davis on September 15, 2016, 10:49:48 PM
Apparently round earthers will believe anything if you put some folks with labcoats on around it in a scientific looking room. How gullible can you be?
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: inquisitive on September 15, 2016, 11:38:43 PM
Apparently round earthers will believe anything if you put some folks with labcoats on around it in a scientific looking room. How gullible can you be?
Show what measurements of a round earth are incorrect.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: John Davis on September 15, 2016, 11:59:29 PM
I'm going down that path in another thread. People complain of the amount of evidence presented.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: zork on September 16, 2016, 02:56:12 AM
 They complain about getting list of arbitrary quotes from somewhere instead of evidence.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: johnnyorbital on September 16, 2016, 09:06:47 AM
where's your evidence for your claim?

you're actually kind of correct, it is an energy barrier, protecting us from the sun

nothing comes in or out though? That's wrong, we can track meteors and there's artifacts ON the moon that humans left there

you can't just say the reflector test doesn't exist, I've personally seen it work


There were numerous attempts to nuke the dome in "operation fishbowl" with rockets and the highest they ever got was 680 miles. Since the fake Moon landings astronauts have only been traveling within 400 miles.

I clearly said "Meteorites maybe be able to fall into it, but we can't send rockets out of the dome."  I think the dome is there mainly to trap us the inhabitants of earth. Like a giant roach motel it may let physical objects fall in though the top, but it won't let us leave.  After all we seem to be valuable livestock to whom or whatever constructed the dome, and ranchers don't just let cattle wonder outside their fenced property.

 The reflector test can easily be explained by the fact that some parts of the moon are more reflective then others.  We also have more powerful and precise lasers now then we did when MIT first did reflective tests on the moon in the 1950s.

again, you've just made claims with no evidence

this is a debate forum, not a baseless suggestion forum, debates include reasoning and evidence
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: Cartog on September 17, 2016, 04:28:54 PM
The following groups attempt to claim that the Earth is round:
  • The 7 countries with territorial claims on Antarctica (The alleged location of the Ice Wall)
  • The staffers of all the research bases in the Arctic
  • The top leaders of space programs of the US, the Soviet Union, and China
  • The 533 people that have allegedly orbited Earth
  • The 24 people that allegedly have gone beyond low-Earth orbit, and
  • The 12 people that allegedly set foot on the moon.

I wanted to interrupt, Only those groups??  Only 7 countries - not any others?  Only the top leaders of the space programs of three countries - none of the scientists below the top leaders, nobody in the space programs of such other countries?  Only the people who have orbited earth and nobody who stayed on earth? and so forth. 

Even so, that list posits more than a thousand people.  How many people on this forum seriously and sincerely believe that the Earth is flat?  I count about 20, maybe 30.  If we start sifting the demographics by eliminating highschool dropouts, we still have more than a thousand on one side and less than 30 on the other.
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: N30 on September 17, 2016, 07:38:38 PM
The following groups attempt to claim that the Earth is round:
  • The 7 countries with territorial claims on Antarctica (The alleged location of the Ice Wall)
  • The staffers of all the research bases in the Arctic
  • The top leaders of space programs of the US, the Soviet Union, and China
  • The 533 people that have allegedly orbited Earth
  • The 24 people that allegedly have gone beyond low-Earth orbit, and
  • The 12 people that allegedly set foot on the moon.

1. America is the only superpower in Antarctica 24/7 hours a day, non-stop, it might as well be their territory.
2. Why would they need to know the whole truth? So long as they do not cross boundaries set by the U.S...
3. Please.
4. That is a relatively small number to be kept quiet.
5. You lost me at "allegedly".
6. See number 5.

If a person was fooled into trusting a lie from birth, then they could be fooled into trusting anything.

(https://ronabbass.files.wordpress.com/2013/10/they-live-news.jpg)
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: johnnyorbital on September 18, 2016, 01:07:08 AM
so, when flat earthers thought Admiral Byrd supported their argument they used to quote him all the time

since I told people he blatantly repeats throughout his interview 'the continent of Antarctica', I've not heard them mention him once

people ARE allowed to Antarctica

if you want a mystery, and you've done ANY research, try looking into why the massive ice shelf is now named 'The Rockefeller Plateau'

then, do yourself a favour and search 'Andrea Barnes' to understand why the flat earth faith has made a comeback
Title: Re: Why is the government hiding the flat earth from us?
Post by: wise on September 30, 2016, 06:39:08 AM
Because our government is dishonorable.