The Flat Earth Society

Flat Earth Discussion Boards => Flat Earth Debate => Topic started by: FinnishArmy on June 26, 2015, 12:27:52 PM

Title: What About The ISS?
Post by: FinnishArmy on June 26, 2015, 12:27:52 PM
If the Earth is "flat" then how can the ISS and every other satellite fly around the Earth?

                     If Earth is flat, does that make everything in space flat?
 (no)
The gravitational pull of EVERY OBJECT IS SPACE causes it to be impossible to be flat.

   Care to explain?
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: mikeman7918 on June 26, 2015, 02:18:51 PM
This point has been made many times on this forum.  The most popular explanations are that there is a conspiracy to hide the shape of the Earth which puts up balloons which somehow travel in jet-streams at 17,000 miles per hour.  Some think that the ISS is a jet flying around with the afterburner on that somehow looks like this from Earth:

(http://38.media.tumblr.com/81a5b33f123dcc87ee4535feb4486f3e/tumblr_inline_ne21qetldu1rxan1s.jpg)
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: modestman on June 26, 2015, 02:26:11 PM
This point has been made many times on this forum.  The most popular explanations are that there is a conspiracy to hide the shape of the Earth which puts up balloons which somehow travel in jet-streams at 17,000 miles per hour.  Some think that the ISS is a jet flying around with the afterburner on that somehow looks like this from Earth:

(http://38.media.tumblr.com/81a5b33f123dcc87ee4535feb4486f3e/tumblr_inline_ne21qetldu1rxan1s.jpg)
If you think this photo is not fake why don't you just show us the earth from space this will be ultimately proof.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: mikeman7918 on June 26, 2015, 02:34:59 PM
This point has been made many times on this forum.  The most popular explanations are that there is a conspiracy to hide the shape of the Earth which puts up balloons which somehow travel in jet-streams at 17,000 miles per hour.  Some think that the ISS is a jet flying around with the afterburner on that somehow looks like this from Earth:

(http://38.media.tumblr.com/81a5b33f123dcc87ee4535feb4486f3e/tumblr_inline_ne21qetldu1rxan1s.jpg)
If you think this photo is not fake why don't you just show us the earth from space this will be ultimately proof.

That photo was taken by an ordinary person with a telescope.  There are many images like it all over the internet from people who photographed the ISS using equipment you can buy yourself if you want.  I am even thinking about aiming my telescope at the ISS and seeing what I see.  I'll let you know if it looks like anything other then a space station.

Also, I will do more then just post a photo of Earth, here is a live video stream from the ISS:

Live_ISS_Stream on USTREAM: Live video from the International Space Station includes internal views when the crew is on-duty and Earth views at other times... (http://www.ustream.tv/channel/live-iss-stream#)

I would love to know how you think they fake that.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: modestman on June 26, 2015, 02:36:45 PM
This point has been made many times on this forum.  The most popular explanations are that there is a conspiracy to hide the shape of the Earth which puts up balloons which somehow travel in jet-streams at 17,000 miles per hour.  Some think that the ISS is a jet flying around with the afterburner on that somehow looks like this from Earth:

(http://38.media.tumblr.com/81a5b33f123dcc87ee4535feb4486f3e/tumblr_inline_ne21qetldu1rxan1s.jpg)
If you think this photo is not fake why don't you just show us the earth from space this will be ultimately proof.

That photo was taken by an ordinary person with a telescope.  There are many images like it all over the internet from people who photographed the ISS using equipment you can buy yourself if you want.  I am even thinking about aiming my telescope at the ISS and seeing what I see.  I'll let you know if it looks like anything other then a space station.

Also, I will do more then just post a photo of Earth, here is a live video stream from the ISS:

Live_ISS_Stream on USTREAM: Live video from the International Space Station includes internal views when the crew is on-duty and Earth views at other times... (http://www.ustream.tv/channel/live-iss-stream#)

I would love to know how you think they fake that.
with billion dollar my grandmother would be able to fake it.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: mikeman7918 on June 26, 2015, 02:38:39 PM
This point has been made many times on this forum.  The most popular explanations are that there is a conspiracy to hide the shape of the Earth which puts up balloons which somehow travel in jet-streams at 17,000 miles per hour.  Some think that the ISS is a jet flying around with the afterburner on that somehow looks like this from Earth:

(http://38.media.tumblr.com/81a5b33f123dcc87ee4535feb4486f3e/tumblr_inline_ne21qetldu1rxan1s.jpg)
If you think this photo is not fake why don't you just show us the earth from space this will be ultimately proof.

That photo was taken by an ordinary person with a telescope.  There are many images like it all over the internet from people who photographed the ISS using equipment you can buy yourself if you want.  I am even thinking about aiming my telescope at the ISS and seeing what I see.  I'll let you know if it looks like anything other then a space station.

Also, I will do more then just post a photo of Earth, here is a live video stream from the ISS:

Live_ISS_Stream on USTREAM: Live video from the International Space Station includes internal views when the crew is on-duty and Earth views at other times... (http://www.ustream.tv/channel/live-iss-stream#)

I would love to know how you think they fake that.
with billion dollar my grandmother would be able to fake it.

You should look at the feed when there is a thunderstorm over you and when the ISS is over your head.  If you don't see a thunderstorm from the live feed then you know it's fake.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: modestman on June 26, 2015, 02:51:35 PM
This point has been made many times on this forum.  The most popular explanations are that there is a conspiracy to hide the shape of the Earth which puts up balloons which somehow travel in jet-streams at 17,000 miles per hour.  Some think that the ISS is a jet flying around with the afterburner on that somehow looks like this from Earth:

(http://38.media.tumblr.com/81a5b33f123dcc87ee4535feb4486f3e/tumblr_inline_ne21qetldu1rxan1s.jpg)
If you think this photo is not fake why don't you just show us the earth from space this will be ultimately proof.

That photo was taken by an ordinary person with a telescope.  There are many images like it all over the internet from people who photographed the ISS using equipment you can buy yourself if you want.  I am even thinking about aiming my telescope at the ISS and seeing what I see.  I'll let you know if it looks like anything other then a space station.

Also, I will do more then just post a photo of Earth, here is a live video stream from the ISS:

Live_ISS_Stream on USTREAM: Live video from the International Space Station includes internal views when the crew is on-duty and Earth views at other times... (http://www.ustream.tv/channel/live-iss-stream#)

I would love to know how you think they fake that.
with billion dollar my grandmother would be able to fake it.

You should look at the feed when there is a thunderstorm over you and when the ISS is over your head.  If you don't see a thunderstorm from the live feed then you know it's fake.
I already saw a video where there is a mistake like that with satellite so I know it can happen with the ISS.
I saw the Live stream - and the earth seems flat like coin but that doesn't mean it's not cgi because it either cgi or animation or when you take the camera and point it to sky and show it like you above the sky, despite you are below.
it's so easy to fake and multiply agencies doing that right now, how you explain the bubbles in space ?
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: JerkFace on June 26, 2015, 10:35:23 PM
it's so easy to fake and multiply agencies doing that right now, how you explain the bubbles in space ?

You weren't supposed to see those bubbles.   ;D 

(http://www.nasa.gov/centers/goddard/images/content/195573main1_hst_divers3_300px.jpg)

Training for a hubble repair mission.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: JerkFace on June 26, 2015, 10:41:24 PM
If you think this photo is not fake why don't you just show us the earth from space this will be ultimately proof.

(http://imageshack.com/a/img538/9096/SCb6U1.png)

Proof enough?
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: mikeman7918 on June 26, 2015, 10:57:47 PM
I already saw a video where there is a mistake like that with satellite so I know it can happen with the ISS.
I saw the Live stream - and the earth seems flat like coin but that doesn't mean it's not cgi because it either cgi or animation or when you take the camera and point it to sky and show it like you above the sky, despite you are below.
it's so easy to fake and multiply agencies doing that right now, how you explain the bubbles in space ?

I'm not sure what those alleged "space bubbles" are, but I know that they are not bubbles.  Bubbles move only up and never down, do you agree?  There are a few of the videos showing alleged bubbles which appeared to move up, down a bit, and then back up.  I could find the video and show you where in it to look tomorrow if you want..

If the ISS videos were filmed in a pool then how do you explain the lack of blue haze?

Astronaut training pools look like this:
(http://www.bestrussiantour.com/files/imagecache/photogallery_full/photos/gallery/DSC_4972.JPG)

And you think that images like this were taken in a pool:
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/42/STS-134_EVA-4_ISS_View.jpg)

Note how even the furthest solar panels look perfectly clear, which wouldn't happen in water.

There are also thinks like refraction.  In a space suit under water a diver's head should apear very small because water is denser then the air inside the suit.  This is exactaly what we observe:
(http://www.fragileoasis.net/imgs/080111-Final-Chapter-4/ron-nbl.jpg)

In space on the other hand, the vacuum is less dense then the air inside the helmet so the astronaut's head should look very big.  This is exactaly what we observe:
(http://media3.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/photo/gallery/090326/GAL-09Mar26-1787/media/PHO-09Mar26-155778.jpg)

This means that the astronauts are not under water but in a vacuum, and that means the only way they could be floating like that is if they are in zero G.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: sceptimatic on June 27, 2015, 08:51:12 AM
it's so easy to fake and multiply agencies doing that right now, how you explain the bubbles in space ?

You weren't supposed to see those bubbles.   ;D 

(http://www.nasa.gov/centers/goddard/images/content/195573main1_hst_divers3_300px.jpg)

Training for a hubble repair mission.
Priceless this. Training for a Hubble repair mission by being under water pressure.  ;D
Training under water pressure, where we all know it's pretty hard to  move your arms and body due to having to PUSH them through the water.
Also to move, you kick your feet under water.
In so called space, there is no kicking of feet because they obviously know that we know the vacuum doesn't allow it by what we are told.

We also know that moving their arms about in a so called space vacuum would mean they would be flapping about like beached fish, unless they were on a rope or holding part of the Hubble (cough).

Now then; the second they grab something, they are going to put a force on it, which means that every time they bang into the Hubble, they move it out of alignment and into space further or lesser, depending on how you want to view the bullshit.

So here's the key for anyone that wants to train for something. Let's use abseiling as an instance.
Ok, what you do to train is, you go up a tall building or a small vertical rock face or something like that....but...instead of simply abseiling down it like we all know you do....we do it N.A.S.A style.....I I said N.A.S.A style. It's N.A.S.A style.

What we do is, we  place the people deep underwater where there is a large rock face and have them stand on it  with ropes and scuba gear on.
Then you tell them to abseil down this underwater rock face until they reach the sea bed. Once they do a few of these, they can then feel ready to tackle a high building or a rock face on land.

Best way to train, right?

It must be if N.A.S.A gangnam style space jaunts are perfected in a large frigging pool.  ;D
What in the hell does it require for people to wake the fu...fu...fu...hell up?  ::)
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Alpha2Omega on June 27, 2015, 09:20:54 AM
What we do is, we  place the people deep underwater where there is a large rock face and have them stand on it  with ropes and scuba gear on.
Then you tell them to abseil down this underwater rock face until they reach the sea bed. Once they do a few of these, they can then feel ready to tackle a high building or a rock face on land.

Best way to train, right?

How are you going to rappel down an underwater rock face if you have neutral buoyancy, or are you proposing negative buoyancy so you can practice underwater? You wouldn't have to worry about falls, but this seems like a hard way to do it and it isn't realistic enough to be useful training; we used to just find a very short pitch to train people how to start a rappel (which is the hardest part) and practice, but wasn't high enough to be really dangerous, then provide a belay for the first time on a dangerously-high drop. This is simpler and much more practical than trying to do this underwater.

Neutral buoyancy appears to be good practice for some aspects of working in a weightless environment. Obviously it's not totally realistic, but apparently still useful.

We can always count on you for a good chuckle.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Yendor on June 27, 2015, 10:07:53 AM
These space men always look so happy with their smiling faces. Yet everywhere you look on the outside of the ISS is sharp objects that could easily tear or rip their suits open. Just look at the pictures Mikeman shows plenty of sharp objects in those pictures. Plus i wouldn't want to be that close to a big solar panel like that, couldn't it shock you? I don't know, but shouldn't it be putting out a lot of voltage. Why do they have to go outside so much anyway. They should have designed it so you wouldn't have to go outside. Id also be afraid space junk could plow into me and break my helmet glass. Just my thoughts.
Yendor
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: modestman on June 27, 2015, 11:00:31 AM
it's so easy to fake and multiply agencies doing that right now, how you explain the bubbles in space ?

You weren't supposed to see those bubbles.   ;D 

(http://www.nasa.gov/centers/goddard/images/content/195573main1_hst_divers3_300px.jpg)

Training for a hubble repair mission.
The people with the astronot suit don't have a lot of bubbles but in the video where they do space walk you see enough bubbles to determine they are in pool.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: modestman on June 27, 2015, 11:02:09 AM
I already saw a video where there is a mistake like that with satellite so I know it can happen with the ISS.
I saw the Live stream - and the earth seems flat like coin but that doesn't mean it's not cgi because it either cgi or animation or when you take the camera and point it to sky and show it like you above the sky, despite you are below.
it's so easy to fake and multiply agencies doing that right now, how you explain the bubbles in space ?

I'm not sure what those alleged "space bubbles" are, but I know that they are not bubbles.  Bubbles move only up and never down, do you agree?  There are a few of the videos showing alleged bubbles which appeared to move up, down a bit, and then back up.  I could find the video and show you where in it to look tomorrow if you want..

If the ISS videos were filmed in a pool then how do you explain the lack of blue haze?

Astronaut training pools look like this:
(http://www.bestrussiantour.com/files/imagecache/photogallery_full/photos/gallery/DSC_4972.JPG)

And you think that images like this were taken in a pool:
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/42/STS-134_EVA-4_ISS_View.jpg)

Note how even the furthest solar panels look perfectly clear, which wouldn't happen in water.

There are also thinks like refraction.  In a space suit under water a diver's head should apear very small because water is denser then the air inside the suit.  This is exactaly what we observe:
(http://www.fragileoasis.net/imgs/080111-Final-Chapter-4/ron-nbl.jpg)

In space on the other hand, the vacuum is less dense then the air inside the helmet so the astronaut's head should look very big.  This is exactaly what we observe:
(http://media3.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/photo/gallery/090326/GAL-09Mar26-1787/media/PHO-09Mar26-155778.jpg)

This means that the astronauts are not under water but in a vacuum, and that means the only way they could be floating like that is if they are in zero G.
the photos where you show the face of the astronot smaller than alleged astronot in space is due to the angle and distance and due to the different mask.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Mikey T. on June 27, 2015, 11:32:55 AM
Plus i wouldn't want to be that close to a big solar panel like that, couldn't it shock you? I don't know, but shouldn't it be putting out a lot of voltage.
Are you serious here?
So, anything to do with electromagnetic signals, electricity, or gravity, you seem to have no clue about.
Didn't you claim to be some sort of technician once before?  I had doubted that long ago, now I am sure that was false.

Yep found it here:
Please don't keep saying look it up, I was an RF engineer for over 20 years. I know how RF works. An  antenna is made to transmit or receive certain directions with certain gain. The transmitting antenna on a  TV satellite has to be cut or made to transmit the energy field to cover the entire U.S., a very wide area. That means it is working like any antenna that is made to transmit most power in certain direction. The receiving antenna should not have to be pointing directly at the satellite. In fact the antenna could simply be an omni type antenna. You should not have to point a directional antenna at the satellite, simply near its direction. Because you do have to point the receiving antenna directly at it, probably means you are pointing at a antenna on a tower a few hundred miles away. Just my opinion.
So how do you have so little understanding of how signals and electricity works, yet you still think you can claim you worked on RF transmitters for 20 years?  The only thing i can think of is that you worked in some factory packaging these things, you obviously didn't design anything.
I am sorry for the semi personal attack, but someone claiming to have worked in that field, which I have for many years, needs to understand the most basic parts of how it works.  Otherwise you either really sucked at it or you are lying.  I really hope it was the lie, and you actually did do what you claim but are here trolling for fun.  Your statements, conclusions, and questions do not match with any technician.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Alpha2Omega on June 27, 2015, 11:42:42 AM
Plus i wouldn't want to be that close to a big solar panel like that,

No worries. You're more than two hundred miles from it at the closest.

Quote
couldn't it shock you? I don't know, but shouldn't it be putting out a lot of voltage.

Maybe the assembly is UL approved.

Aren't you the guy that claimed to work on spacecraft electrical systems? How come you don't know this?

Oh, wait...
Yes I am technical and i have spent many months developing products for the government that I know ended up on the scrap heap.

I can certainly understand why stuff you developed was scrapped.

Quote
Why do they have to go outside so much anyway.

To fix stuff that breaks. To add new equipment. To test procedures and techniques. How much is "so much"?

Quote
They should have designed it so you wouldn't have to go outside.

How would they fix stuff that breaks, add new equipment, and test procedures and techniques?

Quote
Id also be afraid space junk could plow into me and break my helmet glass.

We can tell that you're not cut out for the job. There is a significant risk involved, and it certainly isn't for everyone.

Quote
Just my thoughts.

Thanks for sharing!
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: mikeman7918 on June 27, 2015, 11:57:00 AM
Priceless this. Training for a Hubble repair mission by being under water pressure.  ;D
Training under water pressure, where we all know it's pretty hard to  move your arms and body due to having to PUSH them through the water.
Also to move, you kick your feet under water.
In so called space, there is no kicking of feet because they obviously know that we know the vacuum doesn't allow it by what we are told.

We also know that moving their arms about in a so called space vacuum would mean they would be flapping about like beached fish, unless they were on a rope or holding part of the Hubble (cough).

Now then; the second they grab something, they are going to put a force on it, which means that every time they bang into the Hubble, they move it out of alignment and into space further or lesser, depending on how you want to view the bullshit.

So here's the key for anyone that wants to train for something. Let's use abseiling as an instance.
Ok, what you do to train is, you go up a tall building or a small vertical rock face or something like that....but...instead of simply abseiling down it like we all know you do....we do it N.A.S.A style.....I I said N.A.S.A style. It's N.A.S.A style.

What we do is, we  place the people deep underwater where there is a large rock face and have them stand on it  with ropes and scuba gear on.
Then you tell them to abseil down this underwater rock face until they reach the sea bed. Once they do a few of these, they can then feel ready to tackle a high building or a rock face on land.

Best way to train, right?

It must be if N.A.S.A gangnam style space jaunts are perfected in a large frigging pool.  ;D
What in the hell does it require for people to wake the fu...fu...fu...hell up?  ::)

The astronauts are in a space suit which is already so stiff that being under water doesn't change much.  The astronauts are not supposed to move around by kicking because that would make their training not very useful.

I don't think you understand what knocking a telescope out of alignment is.  I can pick up my telescope and shake it around and it will still be aligned.  The alignment is all about the alignment of the mirrors and it has nothing to do with the telescope's position and orientation.  The Hubnle also has thrusters and gyroscopes on it to change it's velocity and where it's pointing, so it doesn't matter if the astronauts bump it around.

These space men always look so happy with their smiling faces. Yet everywhere you look on the outside of the ISS is sharp objects that could easily tear or rip their suits open. Just look at the pictures Mikeman shows plenty of sharp objects in those pictures. Plus i wouldn't want to be that close to a big solar panel like that, couldn't it shock you? I don't know, but shouldn't it be putting out a lot of voltage. Why do they have to go outside so much anyway. They should have designed it so you wouldn't have to go outside. Id also be afraid space junk could plow into me and break my helmet glass. Just my thoughts.
Yendor

If you were the kind of person who was scared of doings space walk then you wouldn't go to space, simple as that.  All of NASA's astronauts go to space because they want to, nobody is forced to do it.  The people you see doing space walks are generally the people who think that all the dangers are worth it just to be weightless and see Earth from orbit.  As for all the dangers, their suits are thick and insulation enough to protect them from shocks, and most of the wires aren't even exposed.  Space junk is tracked from Earth and if mission control notices a threat the ISS can change course to avoid it.  Sharp objects are sometimes an issue in space walks, but that's what all that training is for.  MASA works with military precision and they plan space walks to avoid sharp objects whenever they can.  The station was designed to be space walk friendly and NASA knows every nut and bolt of it, so sharp objects aren't that big of a probelem.

EVA's are not something that happens too often on the ISS.  For the most part the station can be maintained from the inside, but sometimes they have to go outside to make a repair, install a new piece of equipment, and things like that.

the photos where you show the face of the astronot smaller than alleged astronot in space is due to the angle and distance and due to the different mask.

The sours used for training are almost identical to the actual space suits.  That refraction thing is a really tiny detail that very few people would notice.  The angle and distance actually doesn't effect it, there are many more photos in the Internet of people in astronaut training pools and people in space.  They all show the same thing, the people in space have large heads while the people in the pools have small heads.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: modestman on June 27, 2015, 12:05:07 PM
Priceless this. Training for a Hubble repair mission by being under water pressure.  ;D
Training under water pressure, where we all know it's pretty hard to  move your arms and body due to having to PUSH them through the water.
Also to move, you kick your feet under water.
In so called space, there is no kicking of feet because they obviously know that we know the vacuum doesn't allow it by what we are told.

We also know that moving their arms about in a so called space vacuum would mean they would be flapping about like beached fish, unless they were on a rope or holding part of the Hubble (cough).

Now then; the second they grab something, they are going to put a force on it, which means that every time they bang into the Hubble, they move it out of alignment and into space further or lesser, depending on how you want to view the bullshit.

So here's the key for anyone that wants to train for something. Let's use abseiling as an instance.
Ok, what you do to train is, you go up a tall building or a small vertical rock face or something like that....but...instead of simply abseiling down it like we all know you do....we do it N.A.S.A style.....I I said N.A.S.A style. It's N.A.S.A style.

What we do is, we  place the people deep underwater where there is a large rock face and have them stand on it  with ropes and scuba gear on.
Then you tell them to abseil down this underwater rock face until they reach the sea bed. Once they do a few of these, they can then feel ready to tackle a high building or a rock face on land.

Best way to train, right?

It must be if N.A.S.A gangnam style space jaunts are perfected in a large frigging pool.  ;D
What in the hell does it require for people to wake the fu...fu...fu...hell up?  ::)

The astronauts are in a space suit which is already so stiff that being under water doesn't change much.  The astronauts are not supposed to move around by kicking because that would make their training not very useful.

I don't think you understand what knocking a telescope out of alignment is.  I can pick up my telescope and shake it around and it will still be aligned.  The alignment is all about the alignment of the mirrors and it has nothing to do with the telescope's position and orientation.  The Hubnle also has thrusters and gyroscopes on it to change it's velocity and where it's pointing, so it doesn't matter if the astronauts bump it around.

These space men always look so happy with their smiling faces. Yet everywhere you look on the outside of the ISS is sharp objects that could easily tear or rip their suits open. Just look at the pictures Mikeman shows plenty of sharp objects in those pictures. Plus i wouldn't want to be that close to a big solar panel like that, couldn't it shock you? I don't know, but shouldn't it be putting out a lot of voltage. Why do they have to go outside so much anyway. They should have designed it so you wouldn't have to go outside. Id also be afraid space junk could plow into me and break my helmet glass. Just my thoughts.
Yendor

If you were the kind of person who was scared of doings space walk then you wouldn't go to space, simple as that.  All of NASA's astronauts go to space because they want to, nobody is forced to do it.  The people you see doing space walks are generally the people who think that all the dangers are worth it just to be weightless and see Earth from orbit.  As for all the dangers, their suits are thick and insulation enough to protect them from shocks, and most of the wires aren't even exposed.  Space junk is tracked from Earth and if mission control notices a threat the ISS can change course to avoid it.  Sharp objects are sometimes an issue in space walks, but that's what all that training is for.  MASA works with military precision and they plan space walks to avoid sharp objects whenever they can.  The station was designed to be space walk friendly and NASA knows every nut and bolt of it, so sharp objects aren't that big of a probelem.

EVA's are not something that happens too often on the ISS.  For the most part the station can be maintained from the inside, but sometimes they have to go outside to make a repair, install a new piece of equipment, and things like that.

the photos where you show the face of the astronot smaller than alleged astronot in space is due to the angle and distance and due to the different mask.

The sours used for training are almost identical to the actual space suits.  That refraction thing is a really tiny detail that very few people would notice.  The angle and distance actually doesn't effect it, there are many more photos in the Internet of people in astronaut training pools and people in space.  They all show the same thing, the people in space have large heads while the people in the pools have small heads.

https://www.google.co.il/search?q=Astronauts+in+pool&biw=1024&bih=573&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=-_KOVaTRM4evU56wgaAN&ved=0CAYQ_AUoAQ#imgrc=Mj5lNtdHg04CAM%3A (https://www.google.co.il/search?q=Astronauts+in+pool&biw=1024&bih=573&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=-_KOVaTRM4evU56wgaAN&ved=0CAYQ_AUoAQ#imgrc=Mj5lNtdHg04CAM%3A)
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: modestman on June 27, 2015, 12:07:06 PM
https://www.google.co.il/search?q=Astronauts+in+pool&biw=1024&bih=573&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=-_KOVaTRM4evU56wgaAN&ved=0CAYQ_AUoAQ#tbm=isch&q=Astronauts+in+space&imgrc=tCylLDHGih6r2M%3A (https://www.google.co.il/search?q=Astronauts+in+pool&biw=1024&bih=573&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=-_KOVaTRM4evU56wgaAN&ved=0CAYQ_AUoAQ#tbm=isch&q=Astronauts+in+space&imgrc=tCylLDHGih6r2M%3A)
fake image like nasa without small head.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: modestman on June 27, 2015, 12:11:36 PM
most of the time they go out to space walk with reflective mask to cover the face not to be shown irregular like in pool. not all the shoots of astronots in pool some of them in mikeman house.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: mikeman7918 on June 27, 2015, 12:43:19 PM
You are still yet to explain why there is no blue haze in ISS space walks.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: modestman on June 27, 2015, 12:44:25 PM
You are still yet to explain why there is no blue haze in ISS space walks.
what that supposed to mean ?
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Misero on June 27, 2015, 12:55:03 PM
Water has a blue haze. Or really, just a colored haze.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: modestman on June 27, 2015, 12:57:49 PM
Water has a blue haze. Or really, just a colored haze.
everything is remake by photoshop or whatever to take out all the irregular.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Mikey T. on June 27, 2015, 01:03:24 PM
Seriously dude, give it up.  You are really just giving ammunition to someone who would point out your lack of intelligent responses.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Yendor on June 27, 2015, 01:05:29 PM
Plus i wouldn't want to be that close to a big solar panel like that, couldn't it shock you? I don't know, but shouldn't it be putting out a lot of voltage.
Are you serious here?
So, anything to do with electromagnetic signals, electricity, or gravity, you seem to have no clue about.
Didn't you claim to be some sort of technician once before?  I had doubted that long ago, now I am sure that was false.

Yep found it here:
Please don't keep saying look it up, I was an RF engineer for over 20 years. I know how RF works. An  antenna is made to transmit or receive certain directions with certain gain. The transmitting antenna on a  TV satellite has to be cut or made to transmit the energy field to cover the entire U.S., a very wide area. That means it is working like any antenna that is made to transmit most power in certain direction. The receiving antenna should not have to be pointing directly at the satellite. In fact the antenna could simply be an omni type antenna. You should not have to point a directional antenna at the satellite, simply near its direction. Because you do have to point the receiving antenna directly at it, probably means you are pointing at a antenna on a tower a few hundred miles away. Just my opinion.
So how do you have so little understanding of how signals and electricity works, yet you still think you can claim you worked on RF transmitters for 20 years?  The only thing i can think of is that you worked in some factory packaging these things, you obviously didn't design anything.
I am sorry for the semi personal attack, but someone claiming to have worked in that field, which I have for many years, needs to understand the most basic parts of how it works.  Otherwise you either really sucked at it or you are lying.  I really hope it was the lie, and you actually did do what you claim but are here trolling for fun.  Your statements, conclusions, and questions do not match with any technician.

Micky T.,

I made the statement that they could shock you, I didn't say they would. If you don't think solar panels can't produce enough electricity to kill you, (1ma for 1 second can kill), Then I now question everything you say. You must be reading everything you've stated from the internet or some books you purchased from a yard sale. Yes I did work for the largest microwave filter company in the world for nearly twenty years as an RF engineer designing microwave filters, GaAs diode switches, PIN diodes, Coaxial switches, computer controlled tunable filters and many other things the government agencies sent me. I also worked for another company  called L3 corp. I designed uplink and downlinks for UAVs that were used in Iraq. Plus I spent six years in the Navy working on guided missile launching systems. plus I worked at smaller companies designing other electronic devices. I probably built my first computer using wire wrap before you were born. So don't give me this song and dance about me knowing nothing just because you want to smear FEers and don't agree with what I believe. You simply don't realize I'm sixty-five years old and I haven't done much math in a long while, But I'll tell you I designed a lot of filters using math and a slide rule. do you even know what they are?

Here is just one place I found on the net that took me about two minutes.

“There’s a potentially lethal situation for firefighters, where anywhere from 40 milliamps (mA) to 240 mA of DC electric current can lock up the muscles and you can’t let go,” says Ken Boyce, UL’s manager and principal engineer for product safety. The current could be strong enough where the firefighter could jump back and fall off the roof, fall into a solar panel, or be strong enough past 240 mA to cause ventricular fibrillation and cause death. At 70 mA, electrical burns causing cell necrosis could come into play, according to UL. Even the amount of light generated from fighting a nighttime fire adjacent to a building with rooftop PV could generate electricity in the solar panels, Boyce added.

So don't come across to me as some kind of electrical genius, you're certainly not.

Yendor
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Mikey T. on June 27, 2015, 01:16:14 PM
Where are they grounded back too in that suit?  Where will the electricity flow?  How will the electricity get through the suit if it is designed to insulate you from extreme heat and cold? 
Also Solar panels are low current and nothing on the outside of the panel is "energized".  So, if there was a wire shorted out to the frame of the solar panel, and if the astronaut ripped his suit enough to touch the frame with his bare skin (BTW he would be dead already anyway), maybe he would get a small does of current if his body were grounded back to the station, not the heavily insulated suit, his body.
So a little simple electricity lesson.  Electricity has to have a path to complete the circuit.  If there is no path this is called an open or dead circuit and no current can flow. 
So tell me again how you designed RF devices.
I call BS again.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Mikey T. on June 27, 2015, 01:21:50 PM
Another thing, you have no idea how old I am.  So what company did you work for that designed UAVs that were used in Iraq.  I used a few different ones.  As for a slide rule, yeah I have messed around with one, and they are an awesome tool for someone who needs it.  You however have no grasp on the basics of how an RF signal works.  I have seen this through a few conversations.  I am not talking about math, I am talking about basic concepts.  These are things that you must know in order to be able to design anything.  So do not give me the old guru routine, you do not qualify.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: modestman on June 27, 2015, 01:24:54 PM
Seriously dude, give it up.  You are really just giving ammunition to someone who would point out your lack of intelligent responses.
You are absolutely doing better job convince more people the earth is flat, I agree.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Yendor on June 27, 2015, 01:27:11 PM
Mikey T.

You say thick insulated suites. Do you even know how thick they are? They are 3/16" thick. Does that sound like heavy insulated to you. And besides that how do you know wires dont enter the suit that isn't exposed to the environment?

Yendor
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Yendor on June 27, 2015, 01:31:14 PM
Seriously dude, give it up.  You are really just giving ammunition to someone who would point out your lack of intelligent responses.
You are absolutely doing better job convince more people the earth is flat, I agree.

Thank you modestman,

I'm not afraid of them. I'm like muhammad ali, 'float like a butterfly, sting like a bee'
Yendor
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Yendor on June 27, 2015, 01:45:23 PM
Mikey T.

Having trouble finding a web site? Here is one.


https://www.idmarch.org/document/P-wave/k6ey-show/Space+Suit+Evolution+From+Custom+Tailored+To+Off-The-Rack+Apollo+Space+Suits+Were+Custom+Tailored+The+Apollo+space+suit+was+basically+a+one-piece+suit.+Each+suit+was+made+to+fit+(custom+tailored)+each+astronaut.+Each+Apo (https://www.idmarch.org/document/P-wave/k6ey-show/Space+Suit+Evolution+From+Custom+Tailored+To+Off-The-Rack+Apollo+Space+Suits+Were+Custom+Tailored+The+Apollo+space+suit+was+basically+a+one-piece+suit.+Each+suit+was+made+to+fit+(custom+tailored)+each+astronaut.+Each+Apo)

I live about twenty miles from there.

Yendor
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: mikeman7918 on June 27, 2015, 01:51:56 PM
Water has a blue haze. Or really, just a colored haze.
everything is remake by photoshop or whatever to take out all the irregular.

Photoshopping every frame in countless hours of video.  Yeah, that totally seems possible. [/sarcasm]
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Alpha2Omega on June 27, 2015, 03:19:35 PM
I made the statement that they could shock you, I didn't say they would. If you don't think solar panels can't produce enough electricity to kill you, (1ma for 1 second can kill)[Citation needed], Then I now question everything you say. You must be reading everything you've stated from the internet or some books you purchased from a yard sale. Yes I did work for the largest microwave filter company in the world for nearly twenty years as an RF engineer designing microwave filters, GaAs diode switches, PIN diodes, Coaxial switches, computer controlled tunable filters and many other things the government agencies sent me.

Which you say they threw away.

Quote
I also worked for another company  called L3 corp. I designed uplink and downlinks for UAVs that were used in Iraq. Plus I spent six years in the Navy working on guided missile launching systems. plus I worked at smaller companies designing other electronic devices.

And yet you claim to believe the Earth is flat. Interesting. This may also explain why:

Yes I am technical and i have spent many months developing products for the government that I know ended up on the scrap heap.

Quote
I probably built my first computer using wire wrap before you were born. So don't give me this song and dance about me knowing nothing just because you want to smear FEers and don't agree with what I believe.

You act like you know nothing and present nothing here that suggests you understand anything useful, so we simply take you at your word.

Quote
You simply don't realize I'm sixty-five years old and I haven't done much math in a long while, But I'll tell you I designed a lot of filters using math and a slide rule.

Did the filters work?

Quote
do you even know what they are?

Filters, math, or slide rules?

Quote
Here is just one place I found on the net that took me about two minutes.

“There’s a potentially lethal situation for firefighters, where anywhere from 40 milliamps (mA) to 240 mA of DC electric current can lock up the muscles and you can’t let go,” says Ken Boyce, UL’s manager and principal engineer for product safety. The current could be strong enough where the firefighter could jump back and fall off the roof, fall into a solar panel, or be strong enough past 240 mA to cause ventricular fibrillation and cause death. At 70 mA, electrical burns causing cell necrosis could come into play, according to UL. Even the amount of light generated from fighting a nighttime fire adjacent to a building with rooftop PV could generate electricity in the solar panels, Boyce added.

Didn't you say it only took 1 mA to kill ya'?

Quote
So don't come across to me as some kind of electrical genius, you're certainly not.

Yendor

You don't come across as much of one, that's for sure! I keep hoping it's an act. This is a funny place.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Yendor on June 28, 2015, 07:30:11 AM
I made the statement that they could shock you, I didn't say they would. If you don't think solar panels can't produce enough electricity to kill you, (1ma for 1 second can kill)[Citation needed], Then I now question everything you say. You must be reading everything you've stated from the internet or some books you purchased from a yard sale. Yes I did work for the largest microwave filter company in the world for nearly twenty years as an RF engineer designing microwave filters, GaAs diode switches, PIN diodes, Coaxial switches, computer controlled tunable filters and many other things the government agencies sent me.

Which you say they threw away.

Quote
I also worked for another company  called L3 corp. I designed uplink and downlinks for UAVs that were used in Iraq. Plus I spent six years in the Navy working on guided missile launching systems. plus I worked at smaller companies designing other electronic devices.

And yet you claim to believe the Earth is flat. Interesting. This may also explain why:

Yes I am technical and i have spent many months developing products for the government that I know ended up on the scrap heap.

Quote
I probably built my first computer using wire wrap before you were born. So don't give me this song and dance about me knowing nothing just because you want to smear FEers and don't agree with what I believe.

You act like you know nothing and present nothing here that suggests you understand anything useful, so we simply take you at your word.

Quote
You simply don't realize I'm sixty-five years old and I haven't done much math in a long while, But I'll tell you I designed a lot of filters using math and a slide rule.

Did the filters work?

Quote
do you even know what they are?

Filters, math, or slide rules?

Quote
Here is just one place I found on the net that took me about two minutes.

“There’s a potentially lethal situation for firefighters, where anywhere from 40 milliamps (mA) to 240 mA of DC electric current can lock up the muscles and you can’t let go,” says Ken Boyce, UL’s manager and principal engineer for product safety. The current could be strong enough where the firefighter could jump back and fall off the roof, fall into a solar panel, or be strong enough past 240 mA to cause ventricular fibrillation and cause death. At 70 mA, electrical burns causing cell necrosis could come into play, according to UL. Even the amount of light generated from fighting a nighttime fire adjacent to a building with rooftop PV could generate electricity in the solar panels, Boyce added.

Didn't you say it only took 1 mA to kill ya'?

Quote
So don't come across to me as some kind of electrical genius, you're certainly not.

Yendor

You don't come across as much of one, that's for sure! I keep hoping it's an act. This is a funny place.


Good morning Alpha20mega,

When I said a lot ended on the scrap heap, is because The government orders a lot of stuff they know won't be used for anything. Especially stuff for satellites. This is because it keeps government contractors and engineers like me busy.  I believe the rest you posted was you trying to be funny again, HaHa

Yendor
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Mikey T. on June 28, 2015, 07:40:47 AM
Alpha, Yendor clearly doesn't understand the basic concepts of electricity.  He is here just trolling for fun.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: sceptimatic on June 28, 2015, 07:51:12 AM
Alpha, Yendor clearly doesn't understand the basic concepts of electricity.  He is here just trolling for fun.
Nah; Yendor isn't trolling for fun. He may be having fun but it's you that's trying to troll and it isn't fore fun.
Yendor is posing legitimate stuff and asking legitimate questions. The fact that they scare you is why you're cacking your panties.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: charles bloomington on June 28, 2015, 07:57:41 AM
If you think this photo is not fake why don't you just show us the earth from space this will be ultimately proof.

(http://imageshack.com/a/img538/9096/SCb6U1.png)

Proof enough?
Gezz earth seems close at 400km . ::)
Thunderbirds TV Show Intro: (http://)

Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: mlwinfrey on June 28, 2015, 08:39:16 AM
If you think this photo is not fake why don't you just show us the earth from space this will be ultimately proof.

(http://imageshack.com/a/img538/9096/SCb6U1.png)

Proof enough?
Gezz earth seems close at 400km . ::)
Thunderbirds TV Show Intro: (http://)

400km as compared to a 25000km earth is incredibly close!  It is 16/1000 of the total circumference of the earth.  If the earth were a 10yard ball (360") this would be 5.7" above the surface. 

As far as the Thunderbirds, seems a bit random but was an interesting show when I saw reruns as a kid.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: charles bloomington on June 28, 2015, 09:01:01 AM
If you think this photo is not fake why don't you just show us the earth from space this will be ultimately proof.

(http://imageshack.com/a/img538/9096/SCb6U1.png)

Proof enough?
Gezz earth seems close at 400km . ::)
Thunderbirds TV Show Intro: (http://)

400km as compared to a 25000km earth is incredibly close!  It is 16/1000 of the total circumference of the earth.  If the earth were a 10yard ball (360") this would be 5.7" above the surface. 

As far as the Thunderbirds, seems a bit random but was an interesting show when I saw reruns as a kid.
400km  is 1312336 ft.  Here is a photo at 120000 ft http://swns.com/wp-content/themes/wp-clear/scripts/timthumb.php?src=http://swns.com/wp-content/uploads/rower1-1024x768.jpg&w=600&h=450&zc=1 (http://swns.com/wp-content/themes/wp-clear/scripts/timthumb.php?src=http://swns.com/wp-content/uploads/rower1-1024x768.jpg&w=600&h=450&zc=1)
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: JimmyTheCrab on June 28, 2015, 09:32:28 AM


400km  is 1312336 ft.  Here is a photo at 120000 ft http://swns.com/wp-content/themes/wp-clear/scripts/timthumb.php?src=http://swns.com/wp-content/uploads/rower1-1024x768.jpg&w=600&h=450&zc=1 (http://swns.com/wp-content/themes/wp-clear/scripts/timthumb.php?src=http://swns.com/wp-content/uploads/rower1-1024x768.jpg&w=600&h=450&zc=1)
Definite curve there.  Looks like the earth is round after all.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: mikeman7918 on June 28, 2015, 09:56:12 AM
If the camera is not pointed directly at the horizon then the curve will apear to be more or less curved then it actually is, and if a camera is pointed perfectly strait forward at a 90 degree angle from down or up then the horizon will always appear perfectly strait.  These are problems that arise for the same reason that there is no perfect flat Earth map: a sphere cannot be perfectly projected on a flat surface.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Alpha2Omega on June 28, 2015, 10:14:50 AM
I made the statement that they could shock you, I didn't say they would. If you don't think solar panels can't produce enough electricity to kill you, (1ma for 1 second can kill)[Citation needed], Then I now question everything you say. You must be reading everything you've stated from the internet or some books you purchased from a yard sale. Yes I did work for the largest microwave filter company in the world for nearly twenty years as an RF engineer designing microwave filters, GaAs diode switches, PIN diodes, Coaxial switches, computer controlled tunable filters and many other things the government agencies sent me.

Which you say they threw away.

Quote
I also worked for another company  called L3 corp. I designed uplink and downlinks for UAVs that were used in Iraq. Plus I spent six years in the Navy working on guided missile launching systems. plus I worked at smaller companies designing other electronic devices.

And yet you claim to believe the Earth is flat. Interesting. This may also explain why:

Yes I am technical and i have spent many months developing products for the government that I know ended up on the scrap heap.

Quote
I probably built my first computer using wire wrap before you were born. So don't give me this song and dance about me knowing nothing just because you want to smear FEers and don't agree with what I believe.

You act like you know nothing and present nothing here that suggests you understand anything useful, so we simply take you at your word.

Quote
You simply don't realize I'm sixty-five years old and I haven't done much math in a long while, But I'll tell you I designed a lot of filters using math and a slide rule.

Did the filters work?

Quote
do you even know what they are?

Filters, math, or slide rules?

Quote
Here is just one place I found on the net that took me about two minutes.

“There’s a potentially lethal situation for firefighters, where anywhere from 40 milliamps (mA) to 240 mA of DC electric current can lock up the muscles and you can’t let go,” says Ken Boyce, UL’s manager and principal engineer for product safety. The current could be strong enough where the firefighter could jump back and fall off the roof, fall into a solar panel, or be strong enough past 240 mA to cause ventricular fibrillation and cause death. At 70 mA, electrical burns causing cell necrosis could come into play, according to UL. Even the amount of light generated from fighting a nighttime fire adjacent to a building with rooftop PV could generate electricity in the solar panels, Boyce added.

Didn't you say it only took 1 mA to kill ya'?

Quote
So don't come across to me as some kind of electrical genius, you're certainly not.

Yendor

You don't come across as much of one, that's for sure! I keep hoping it's an act. This is a funny place.


Good morning Alpha20mega,

When I said a lot ended on the scrap heap, is because The government orders a lot of stuff they know won't be used for anything. Especially stuff for satellites. This is because it keeps government contractors and engineers like me busy. 

No wonder it's your stuff that ended up on the heap.

Quote
I believe the rest you posted was you trying to be funny again, HaHa

Avoiding the questions, I see.

No reference for the lethality of 1 mA? Why the concern that 40 - 240 mA can "lock up your muscles and you can't let go" if 1 mA is all it takes to finish you off?

Did your filters work?
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: modestman on June 28, 2015, 12:00:53 PM
If the camera is not pointed directly at the horizon then the curve will apear to be more or less curved then it actually is, and if a camera is pointed perfectly strait forward at a 90 degree angle from down or up then the horizon will always appear perfectly strait.  These are problems that arise for the same reason that there is no perfect flat Earth map: a sphere cannot be perfectly projected on a flat surface.
So you admit the earth is flat ?
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: mikeman7918 on June 28, 2015, 12:18:55 PM
If the camera is not pointed directly at the horizon then the curve will apear to be more or less curved then it actually is, and if a camera is pointed perfectly strait forward at a 90 degree angle from down or up then the horizon will always appear perfectly strait.  These are problems that arise for the same reason that there is no perfect flat Earth map: a sphere cannot be perfectly projected on a flat surface.
So you admit the earth is flat ?

Nope.  Even if the horizon were below eye level my statement would be true.  This would also mean that if you looked down at the horizon it would appear curved.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: modestman on June 28, 2015, 01:28:15 PM
If the camera is not pointed directly at the horizon then the curve will apear to be more or less curved then it actually is, and if a camera is pointed perfectly strait forward at a 90 degree angle from down or up then the horizon will always appear perfectly strait.  These are problems that arise for the same reason that there is no perfect flat Earth map: a sphere cannot be perfectly projected on a flat surface.
So you admit the earth is flat ?

Nope.  Even if the horizon were below eye level my statement would be true.  This would also mean that if you looked down at the horizon it would appear curved.
so do you admit the camera always create the curvature and just like there is no curvature in shore height there is no curvature in 120000 feet.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Misero on June 28, 2015, 01:30:35 PM
Listen closely, some of it is from the camera. But there is no curve that can be easily discerned by the naked eye at sea level.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: modestman on June 28, 2015, 01:58:51 PM
But there is no curve that can be easily discerned by the naked eye at sea level.
exactly.no curvature at sea level.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Misero on June 28, 2015, 02:13:42 PM
No easily discernable curvature, no.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Yendor on June 28, 2015, 03:06:07 PM
Mikey T.

I worked for a company called BAI Aerosystems that was later bought out by L3 Corporation. I'm surprised you've never heard of them. We did work for NavAir, surely you've heard of them. So mikey T. what kind of work do you do? All I've heard from you is you install satellite dishes, and that makes you a whiz bang in electronics. For someone who doesn't realize solar panels can kill, ought not criticize other people's knowledge of electronics. You are correct when I was trolling you, before I became a flat Earther, I just wanted to see how smart you were in electronics because I had read one of your comments, saying how smart you were in electronics. I'm always skeptical when I hear someone say how smart they are in electronics. Needless to say, I wasn't impressed. So mikey, keep on installing your dish antennas and leave the real electronics to us pros.

Yendor
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: mikeman7918 on June 28, 2015, 03:34:55 PM
Mikey T.

I worked for a company called BAI Aerosystems that was later bought out by L3 Corporation. I'm surprised you've never heard of them. We did work for NavAir, surely you've heard of them. So mikey T. what kind of work do you do? All I've heard from you is you install satellite dishes, and that makes you a whiz bang in electronics. For someone who doesn't realize solar panels can kill, ought not criticize other people's knowledge of electronics. You are correct when I was trolling you, before I became a flat Earther, I just wanted to see how smart you were in electronics because I had read one of your comments, saying how smart you were in electronics. I'm always skeptical when I hear someone say how smart they are in electronics. Needless to say, I wasn't impressed. So mikey, keep on installing your dish antennas and leave the real electronics to us pros.

Yendor

I never said that solar panels can't kill you, I just said that they couldn't kill you when you are in a thick insulative space suit.

so do you admit the camera always create the curvature and just like there is no curvature in shore height there is no curvature in 120000 feet.

Nope, but it is possible for lensing to counter the curvature and make a curved horizon look flat.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: charles bloomington on June 28, 2015, 04:13:37 PM


400km  is 1312336 ft.  Here is a photo at 120000 ft http://swns.com/wp-content/themes/wp-clear/scripts/timthumb.php?src=http://swns.com/wp-content/uploads/rower1-1024x768.jpg&w=600&h=450&zc=1 (http://swns.com/wp-content/themes/wp-clear/scripts/timthumb.php?src=http://swns.com/wp-content/uploads/rower1-1024x768.jpg&w=600&h=450&zc=1)
Definite curve there.  Looks like the earth is round after all.
Tickets please .All aboard the bullshit train . Full streaming shit ahead. Anther supply rocket blows up . That makes 3 if you include the Russian.
What are they breathing up there . What are they eating  & drinking up there .  Dame that shitter must be backed up to the hill . You can only survive on fairy dust shit talk for so long . I, d be a little worried if I was one of those nasa astronaut actors . They might  just  have to take one for the team soon .
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: charles bloomington on June 28, 2015, 04:17:31 PM
http://www.theguardian.com/science/2015/jun/28/nasa-spacex-launch-international-space-station-wrong (http://www.theguardian.com/science/2015/jun/28/nasa-spacex-launch-international-space-station-wrong)
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: sokarul on June 28, 2015, 04:22:26 PM
http://www.theguardian.com/science/2015/jun/28/nasa-spacex-launch-international-space-station-wrong (http://www.theguardian.com/science/2015/jun/28/nasa-spacex-launch-international-space-station-wrong)
And?
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: mikeman7918 on June 28, 2015, 04:57:26 PM
Tickets please .All aboard the bullshit train . Full streaming shit ahead. Anther supply rocket blows up . That makes 3 if you include the Russian.
What are they breathing up there . What are they eating  & drinking up there .  Dame that shitter must be backed up to the hill . You can only survive on fairy dust shit talk for so long . I, d be a little worried if I was one of those nasa astronaut actors . They might  just  have to take one for the team soon .

The ISS has a bunch of extra supplies that are there just in case a rocket doesn't make it to the station.  The people who designed the station thought of this.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: charles bloomington on June 28, 2015, 04:58:10 PM
http://www.theguardian.com/science/2015/jun/28/nasa-spacex-launch-international-space-station-wrong (http://www.theguardian.com/science/2015/jun/28/nasa-spacex-launch-international-space-station-wrong)
And?
And what ? Are you that retarded , you can't figure out its one poorly run phoney side show . Tell me what supplies you could possibley fit in a rocket  of that size, thats room is taken up with needed fuel just to get that bit of junk off the ground. Tell me how your suppose to rondayvoo . How your supose to dock & how your supose to transfer the supplies. If you leaches are going to bleed the public dry of funds , you best improve on your bullshiting. Because your lies have caught up  with you.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: charles bloomington on June 28, 2015, 05:00:19 PM
Tickets please .All aboard the bullshit train . Full streaming shit ahead. Anther supply rocket blows up . That makes 3 if you include the Russian.
What are they breathing up there . What are they eating  & drinking up there .  Dame that shitter must be backed up to the hill . You can only survive on fairy dust shit talk for so long . I, d be a little worried if I was one of those nasa astronaut actors . They might  just  have to take one for the team soon .

The ISS has a bunch of extra supplies that are there just in case a rocket doesn't make it to the station.  The people who designed the station thought of this.
its 3 rockets ass clown . When was the last time they received supplys ?
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Yendor on June 28, 2015, 05:10:50 PM
Mikey T.

I worked for a company called BAI Aerosystems that was later bought out by L3 Corporation. I'm surprised you've never heard of them. We did work for NavAir, surely you've heard of them. So mikey T. what kind of work do you do? All I've heard from you is you install satellite dishes, and that makes you a whiz bang in electronics. For someone who doesn't realize solar panels can kill, ought not criticize other people's knowledge of electronics. You are correct when I was trolling you, before I became a flat Earther, I just wanted to see how smart you were in electronics because I had read one of your comments, saying how smart you were in electronics. I'm always skeptical when I hear someone say how smart they are in electronics. Needless to say, I wasn't impressed. So mikey, keep on installing your dish antennas and leave the real electronics to us pros.

Yendor

I never said that solar panels can't kill you, I just said that they couldn't kill you when you are in a thick insulative space suit.

so do you admit the camera always create the curvature and just like there is no curvature in shore height there is no curvature in 120000 feet.

Nope, but it is possible for lensing to counter the curvature and make a curved horizon look flat.

I'm sorry mikeman,
This post was for mikey T.

Yendor
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: charles bloomington on June 28, 2015, 05:11:35 PM
http://www.newsweek.com/rocket-explosion-probed-russian-step-supply-space-station-280857 (http://www.newsweek.com/rocket-explosion-probed-russian-step-supply-space-station-280857)
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Yendor on June 28, 2015, 05:15:17 PM
Another thing, you have no idea how old I am.  So what company did you work for that designed UAVs that were used in Iraq.  I used a few different ones.  As for a slide rule, yeah I have messed around with one, and they are an awesome tool for someone who needs it.  You however have no grasp on the basics of how an RF signal works.  I have seen this through a few conversations.  I am not talking about math, I am talking about basic concepts.  These are things that you must know in order to be able to design anything.  So do not give me the old guru routine, you do not qualify.

Mikey T.,

I worked for a company called BAI Aerosystems that was later bought out by L3 Corporation. I'm surprised you've never heard of them. We did work for NavAir, surely you've heard of them. So mikey T. what kind of work do you do? All I've heard from you is you install satellite dishes, and that makes you a whiz bang in electronics. For someone who doesn't realize solar panels can kill, ought not criticize other people's knowledge of electronics. You are correct I was trolling you before I became a flat Earther. I just wanted to see how smart you were in electronics because I had read one of your comments, saying how smart you were in electronics. I'm always skeptical when I hear someone say how smart they are in electronics. Needless to say, I wasn't impressed. So mikey, keep on installing your dish antennas and leave the real electronics to us pros.

Yendor
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: mikeman7918 on June 28, 2015, 05:23:47 PM
Mikey T.,

I worked for a company called BAI Aerosystems that was later bought out by L3 Corporation. I'm surprised you've never heard of them. We did work for NavAir, surely you've heard of them. So mikey T. what kind of work do you do? All I've heard from you is you install satellite dishes, and that makes you a whiz bang in electronics. For someone who doesn't realize solar panels can kill, ought not criticize other people's knowledge of electronics. You are correct I was trolling you before I became a flat Earther. I just wanted to see how smart you were in electronics because I had read one of your comments, saying how smart you were in electronics. I'm always skeptical when I hear someone say how smart they are in electronics. Needless to say, I wasn't impressed. So mikey, keep on installing your dish antennas and leave the real electronics to us pros.

Yendor

Speaking of satellite dishes, don't they communicate with satellites that flat Earth theory says don't exist?
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: JerkFace on June 28, 2015, 08:31:30 PM
Another thing, you have no idea how old I am.  So what company did you work for that designed UAVs that were used in Iraq.  I used a few different ones.  As for a slide rule, yeah I have messed around with one, and they are an awesome tool for someone who needs it.  You however have no grasp on the basics of how an RF signal works.  I have seen this through a few conversations.  I am not talking about math, I am talking about basic concepts.  These are things that you must know in order to be able to design anything.  So do not give me the old guru routine, you do not qualify.

Mikey T.,

I worked for a company called BAI Aerosystems that was later bought out by L3 Corporation. I'm surprised you've never heard of them. We did work for NavAir, surely you've heard of them. So mikey T. what kind of work do you do? All I've heard from you is you install satellite dishes, and that makes you a whiz bang in electronics. For someone who doesn't realize solar panels can kill, ought not criticize other people's knowledge of electronics. You are correct I was trolling you before I became a flat Earther. I just wanted to see how smart you were in electronics because I had read one of your comments, saying how smart you were in electronics. I'm always skeptical when I hear someone say how smart they are in electronics. Needless to say, I wasn't impressed. So mikey, keep on installing your dish antennas and leave the real electronics to us pros.

Yendor

Yendor,

I find it very suspicious that in spite of your claims to have worked in the industry  your ignorance of the basics is breathtaking,   I have seen situations before like this,  I have hired EE graduates that don't know which way round a zener diode goes,  and don't know how to wire up a 3 pin mains plug,   but we take them through the training to do the job we want,  and teach them the basics that they should already know.   

Let's take some specifics,   you didn't know the correct terminology for satellite downlink footprints,  you didn't understand that the higher the gain a dish has the greater need for alignment accuracy,  you didn't know what RTK was.   You pretended to not know what a troll was when I accused you of trolling, and here, I see you just admit that you were in fact trolling.

Now you are claiming that touching a solar panel can kill you,  FFS  have you had anything to do with solar?   What part of the panel is going to kill you if you touch it? 
You claim that 1ma will kill,  but you don't mention voltage or frequency or cite any supporting references.   

However, I do agree with you that the ISS wiring looks untidy,  and if it were mil spec, it would all be laced up and tied down neat.   I suspect that a lot of the loose wiring is for non-critical  movable peripheral equipment,  not mission critical life support systems.   Untidy as it is, it's probably more of a proof that it's real, rather than proof that it's faked.

What I said to you before,  was to stop playing the dumb yokel act,  now that you've finally dropped the dumb yokel act, there is the possibility of a sensible debate.

Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: JerkFace on June 28, 2015, 08:40:38 PM
And what ? Are you that retarded , you can't figure out its one poorly run phoney side show . Tell me what supplies you could possibley fit in a rocket  of that size, thats room is taken up with needed fuel just to get that bit of junk off the ground. Tell me how your suppose to rondayvoo . How your supose to dock & how your supose to transfer the supplies. If you leaches are going to bleed the public dry of funds , you best improve on your bullshiting. Because your lies have caught up  with you.

Charles Bloomington,  the space genius.   How did you figure out what supplies were being delivered,  and since you are in Australia,  how much of YOUR money did it cost?
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: mikeman7918 on June 28, 2015, 10:50:39 PM
And what ? Are you that retarded , you can't figure out its one poorly run phoney side show . Tell me what supplies you could possibley fit in a rocket  of that size, thats room is taken up with needed fuel just to get that bit of junk off the ground. Tell me how your suppose to rondayvoo . How your supose to dock & how your supose to transfer the supplies. If you leaches are going to bleed the public dry of funds , you best improve on your bullshiting. Because your lies have caught up  with you.

Here is a video explaining that:

! No longer available (http://#)
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Poko on June 28, 2015, 11:40:49 PM
http://www.theguardian.com/science/2015/jun/28/nasa-spacex-launch-international-space-station-wrong (http://www.theguardian.com/science/2015/jun/28/nasa-spacex-launch-international-space-station-wrong)
And?
And what ? Are you that retarded , you can't figure out its one poorly run phoney side show . Tell me what supplies you could possibley fit in a rocket  of that size, thats room is taken up with needed fuel just to get that bit of junk off the ground. Tell me how your suppose to rondayvoo . How your supose to dock & how your supose to transfer the supplies. If you leaches are going to bleed the public dry of funds , you best improve on your bullshiting. Because your lies have caught up  with you.

I would suggest you play the game Kerbal Space Program. In that game, you are in charge of a space program and your job is to design and launch rockets into space. The game uses real physics and can teach you things about orbital mechanics. If you don't feel like playing the game, you can watch this video (http://) can get the basic idea of how space craft in real life achieve orbit and how they rendezvous.

I really would recommend actually playing the game though. It really can teach you a lot about how real life spacecraft work, how they orbit, and how interplanetary travel is achieved.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: charles bloomington on June 29, 2015, 01:12:07 AM
http://www.theguardian.com/science/2015/jun/28/nasa-spacex-launch-international-space-station-wrong (http://www.theguardian.com/science/2015/jun/28/nasa-spacex-launch-international-space-station-wrong)
And?
And what ? Are you that retarded , you can't figure out its one poorly run phoney side show . Tell me what supplies you could possibley fit in a rocket  of that size, thats room is taken up with needed fuel just to get that bit of junk off the ground. Tell me how your suppose to rondayvoo . How your supose to dock & how your supose to transfer the supplies. If you leaches are going to bleed the public dry of funds , you best improve on your bullshiting. Because your lies have caught up  with you.

I would suggest you play the game Kerbal Space Program. In that game, you are in charge of a space program and your job is to design and launch rockets into space. The game uses real physics and can teach you things about orbital mechanics. If you don't feel like playing the game, you can watch this video (http://) can get the basic idea of how space craft in real life achieve orbit and how they rendezvous.

I really would recommend actually playing the game though. It really can teach you a lot about how real life spacecraft work, how they orbit, and how interplanetary travel is achieved.
I dont play games & this achieving does that include blowing up . You know before you rave on about how amazing this shyt is , you really should take a reality pill.  ::) Thanks for the advice , I will save my quarters  for the game arcade.  Look out NASA astronaut bloomington has just arrived.  ;D
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: JerkFace on June 29, 2015, 01:20:42 AM
http://www.theguardian.com/science/2015/jun/28/nasa-spacex-launch-international-space-station-wrong (http://www.theguardian.com/science/2015/jun/28/nasa-spacex-launch-international-space-station-wrong)
And?
And what ? Are you that retarded , you can't figure out its one poorly run phoney side show . Tell me what supplies you could possibley fit in a rocket  of that size, thats room is taken up with needed fuel just to get that bit of junk off the ground. Tell me how your suppose to rondayvoo . How your supose to dock & how your supose to transfer the supplies. If you leaches are going to bleed the public dry of funds , you best improve on your bullshiting. Because your lies have caught up  with you.

I would suggest you play the game Kerbal Space Program. In that game, you are in charge of a space program and your job is to design and launch rockets into space. The game uses real physics and can teach you things about orbital mechanics. If you don't feel like playing the game, you can watch this video (http://) can get the basic idea of how space craft in real life achieve orbit and how they rendezvous.

I really would recommend actually playing the game though. It really can teach you a lot about how real life spacecraft work, how they orbit, and how interplanetary travel is achieved.
I dont play games & this achieving does that include blowing up . You know before you rave on about how amazing this shyt is , you really should take a reality pill.  ::)

Yes,  rockets blowing up is not uncommon in Kerbal.   You have to be careful and  know what you are doing when you design it.  Do it wrong and boom!

Did you decide if you're Leo Wanker or Russell Coight?
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Yendor on June 29, 2015, 07:12:44 AM
Another thing, you have no idea how old I am.  So what company did you work for that designed UAVs that were used in Iraq.  I used a few different ones.  As for a slide rule, yeah I have messed around with one, and they are an awesome tool for someone who needs it.  You however have no grasp on the basics of how an RF signal works.  I have seen this through a few conversations.  I am not talking about math, I am talking about basic concepts.  These are things that you must know in order to be able to design anything.  So do not give me the old guru routine, you do not qualify.

Mikey T.,

I worked for a company called BAI Aerosystems that was later bought out by L3 Corporation. I'm surprised you've never heard of them. We did work for NavAir, surely you've heard of them. So mikey T. what kind of work do you do? All I've heard from you is you install satellite dishes, and that makes you a whiz bang in electronics. For someone who doesn't realize solar panels can kill, ought not criticize other people's knowledge of electronics. You are correct I was trolling you before I became a flat Earther. I just wanted to see how smart you were in electronics because I had read one of your comments, saying how smart you were in electronics. I'm always skeptical when I hear someone say how smart they are in electronics. Needless to say, I wasn't impressed. So mikey, keep on installing your dish antennas and leave the real electronics to us pros.

Yendor

Yendor,

I find it very suspicious that in spite of your claims to have worked in the industry  your ignorance of the basics is breathtaking,   I have seen situations before like this,  I have hired EE graduates that don't know which way round a zener diode goes,  and don't know how to wire up a 3 pin mains plug,   but we take them through the training to do the job we want,  and teach them the basics that they should already know.   

Let's take some specifics,   you didn't know the correct terminology for satellite downlink footprints,  you didn't understand that the higher the gain a dish has the greater need for alignment accuracy,  you didn't know what RTK was.   You pretended to not know what a troll was when I accused you of trolling, and here, I see you just admit that you were in fact trolling.

Now you are claiming that touching a solar panel can kill you,  FFS  have you had anything to do with solar?   What part of the panel is going to kill you if you touch it? 
You claim that 1ma will kill,  but you don't mention voltage or frequency or cite any supporting references.   

However, I do agree with you that the ISS wiring looks untidy,  and if it were mil spec, it would all be laced up and tied down neat.   I suspect that a lot of the loose wiring is for non-critical  movable peripheral equipment,  not mission critical life support systems.   Untidy as it is, it's probably more of a proof that it's real, rather than proof that it's faked.

What I said to you before,  was to stop playing the dumb yokel act,  now that you've finally dropped the dumb yokel act, there is the possibility of a sensible debate.



Rayzor, Good Morning,

I'm sorry you feel that way about me. "your ignorance of the basics is breathtaking" That is real smart coming from someone who doesn't know what solar panels do and doesn't realize you can very well get shocked from them and possibly get killed. An yes, If you receive 1mA for one second it can do kill. Of course voltage and frequency matters. The voltage has to be high enough to drive the current through your body. When did I say I didn't  know higher gain dish antennas are not more sensitive. High gain dish antennas have a narrower e field because they focus on a narrowers area.
I was trolling mikey T. not you. I'm ending this pissing contest here. If you don't believe what I claim, that's alright because I've seen a lot of people like you who think the know it all when in fact they only know what an engineer told them at the water fountain. Good day,

Yendor
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Yendor on June 29, 2015, 07:25:20 AM
Mikey T.,

I worked for a company called BAI Aerosystems that was later bought out by L3 Corporation. I'm surprised you've never heard of them. We did work for NavAir, surely you've heard of them. So mikey T. what kind of work do you do? All I've heard from you is you install satellite dishes, and that makes you a whiz bang in electronics. For someone who doesn't realize solar panels can kill, ought not criticize other people's knowledge of electronics. You are correct I was trolling you before I became a flat Earther. I just wanted to see how smart you were in electronics because I had read one of your comments, saying how smart you were in electronics. I'm always skeptical when I hear someone say how smart they are in electronics. Needless to say, I wasn't impressed. So mikey, keep on installing your dish antennas and leave the real electronics to us pros.

Yendor

Speaking of satellite dishes, don't they communicate with satellites that flat Earth theory says don't exist?

Good morning Mikeman,

No, if you recall I didn't say I didn't believe in satellites. I said I don't believe they work the way we are told. In fact I said satellites was what was keeping me on the fence so long. Have a good day.

Yendor
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: 29silhouette on June 29, 2015, 08:15:41 AM
I dont play games
Very well.
Quote
& this achieving does that
Achieving interplanetary travel affects whether or not you play games?
Quote
include blowing up .
You blow up as well as not playing video games, all due to interplanetary travel?  ???

You are a confusing individual Charles.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: charles bloomington on June 29, 2015, 08:16:31 AM
And what ? Are you that retarded , you can't figure out its one poorly run phoney side show . Tell me what supplies you could possibley fit in a rocket  of that size, thats room is taken up with needed fuel just to get that bit of junk off the ground. Tell me how your suppose to rondayvoo . How your supose to dock & how your supose to transfer the supplies. If you leaches are going to bleed the public dry of funds , you best improve on your bullshiting. Because your lies have caught up  with you.

Charles Bloomington,  the space genius.   How did you figure out what supplies were being delivered,  and since you are in Australia,  how much of YOUR money did it cost?
Well I kind of figured it wasn't going to be a tube of lube & a pack of condoms for the next upcoming intergalactic space station blow job . Two previous supposed supply rockets apparently  blew up , which  would make this rocket important & having to be loaded with extra  goodies.  Hence where the phuck do  you put the  fuel required , to get that scrap metal off the ground ?
 Considering Australian dollars are floated on the Washington stock exchange under ucc code .I dont think I will ever get to see any of my superannuation money or a pension .
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: JimmyTheCrab on June 29, 2015, 08:19:54 AM
doesn't realize you can very well get shocked from them and possibly get killed.
He didn't say that.

Quote
An yes, If you receive 1mA for one second it can do kill.
Citation?  Although this is completely irrelevant - the astronauts are wearing space suits and there aren't uninsulated wires floating about.

Quote
I've seen a lot of people like you who think the know it all when in fact they only know what an engineer told them at the water fountain.
Real engineers demonstrate their knowledge and skills.  All you do is keep telling everyone about how you worked on this system or that, and then make basic errors.

I suspect you might have had a job with "engineer" in the title - but it also included the words "washing" and "machine"
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: charles bloomington on June 29, 2015, 08:31:08 AM
I dont play games
Very well.
Quote
& this achieving does that
Achieving interplanetary travel affects whether or not you play games?
Quote
include blowing up .
You blow up as well as not playing video games, all due to interplanetary travel?  ???

You are a confusing individual Charles.
No just broken
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Alpha2Omega on June 29, 2015, 08:43:06 AM
I was trolling mikey T.

Thanks for being up front about that. The "ignorant yokel" shtick has gotten stale. Can you drop it, please?
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Yendor on June 29, 2015, 08:44:58 AM
doesn't realize you can very well get shocked from them and possibly get killed.
He didn't say that.

Quote
An yes, If you receive 1mA for one second it can do kill.
Citation?  Although this is completely irrelevant - the astronauts are wearing space suits and there aren't uninsulated wires floating about.

Quote
I've seen a lot of people like you who think the know it all when in fact they only know what an engineer told them at the water fountain.
Real engineers demonstrate their knowledge and skills.  All you do is keep telling everyone about how you worked on this system or that, and then make basic errors.

I suspect you might have had a job with "engineer" in the title - but it also included the words "washing" and "machine"

Good morning Jimmy. I see you are in high spirits today. With your safety in mind, Please be careful when working around high voltage, try to keep one hand behind your back. Because if you get shocked and your one hand is touching ground it may kill you, You see, if your body receives as low as 1mA for one second, given high enough voltage you could be killed. Also watch out for solar panels because they do produce voltage. The same as above, given the right conditions they could hurt you too. Always turn off the breakers before you work around high voltage. Because you REers seem to know very little about electricity, You should pass this information along to them during your weekly meetings. And Jimmy, washing machines need engineers too. Have a good day.

Yendor
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Yendor on June 29, 2015, 08:53:33 AM
I was trolling mikey T.

Thanks for being up front about that. The "ignorant yokel" shtick has gotten stale. Can you drop it, please?

Hello Jimmy,

I'm sorry, I thought you had a little sense of humor and you liked calling me a yokel. My, My what will you call me now? Surprise me. I think you and Mikeman are my favorite REers. Of course with Mikeman's new experiment, he may become a FEer. One never knows. Have a great day.

Yendor
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: JimmyTheCrab on June 29, 2015, 09:43:42 AM
Good morning Jimmy. I see you are in high spirits today. With your safety in mind, Please be careful when working around high voltage, try to keep one hand behind your back.
Yendor, nobody is asking you for advice.

Quote
You see, if your body receives as low as 1mA for one second, given high enough voltage you could be killed.
So, what sort of voltage are we talking here then Yendor?  And I'll ask again: citation.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Mikey T. on June 29, 2015, 12:46:38 PM
Since I didn't get online much yesterday or today, I will answer Yendor really quickly here.  First I never claimed to be some electronics genius.  I did point out your obvious lack of understanding or your purposeful act of ignorance of basic electrical concepts.  Yes I did work as a DirecTV installer for several years, I also was a regional trainer for installers and I traveled to other areas of the country to certify installers.  I am currently not working in a constant engineering field, yet I did just recently graduate with two degrees in engineering (computer and electronics).  I do some consulting work for automation systems for the company I currently work for in addition to my responsibilities as a manager in materials movement.  I do a little side projects in electronics to keep my skills fresh like designing custom home automation systems.  I have a couple of base units that I am in the process of developing to patent for a new project involving home automation.  If I do succeed in getting the patent pending, I will then provide you with plenty of data involving it. 
I believe if you are going to claim to be an engineer, you must know the basic concepts of the engineering field and physics.  So when i see someone claiming such and then spouting complete nonsense I will in fact call you out.  I sacrificed way too much earning my degrees (almost put myself, my wife and my kids into homeless status to do so) to see someone shit all over the profession.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: sceptimatic on June 29, 2015, 12:54:28 PM
Since I didn't get online much yesterday or today, I will answer Yendor really quickly here.  First I never claimed to be some electronics genius.  I did point out your obvious lack of understanding or your purposeful act of ignorance of basic electrical concepts.  Yes I did work as a DirecTV installer for several years, I also was a regional trainer for installers and I traveled to other areas of the country to certify installers.  I am currently not working in a constant engineering field, yet I did just recently graduate with two degrees in engineering (computer and electronics).  I do some consulting work for automation systems for the company I currently work for in addition to my responsibilities as a manager in materials movement.  I do a little side projects in electronics to keep my skills fresh like designing custom home automation systems.  I have a couple of base units that I am in the process of developing to patent for a new project involving home automation.  If I do succeed in getting the patent pending, I will then provide you with plenty of data involving it. 
I believe if you are going to claim to be an engineer, you must know the basic concepts of the engineering field and physics.  So when i see someone claiming such and then spouting complete nonsense I will in fact call you out.  I sacrificed way too much earning my degrees (almost put myself, my wife and my kids into homeless status to do so) to see someone shit all over the profession.
Stop telling so many lies. If you were doing all that, I guarantee you, you wouldn't be sat on here spewing your shit.
Get a grip. Only the really naive one's will fall for your utter bullshit. There's some global Earther's that fit the bill. Pm them and spew your nonsense. I'm sure you can fathom who the gullible one's are.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: JimmyTheCrab on June 29, 2015, 01:43:05 PM
I'm starting to think scepti's shtick is best read as a rap.  Try reading this in your best gangsta stylee:

Stop telling so many lies.
If you were doing all that, I guarantee you,
you wouldn't be sat on here spewing your shit.
Get a grip.
Only the really naive one's will fall for your utter bullshit.
There's some global Earther's that fit the bill.
Pm them and spew your nonsense.
I'm sure you can fathom who the gullible one's are.



Or maybe there isn't enough rhyming - maybe spoken word poetry?
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Mikey T. on June 29, 2015, 01:46:24 PM
Well it's Monday, I am at work.  I was a little busy Sunday and I wasn't here.  If i decide to take a break and sit down and look at what is being said I will.  Once again, I have given you no reason to call me a liar.  You just can't argue against me so your only option is to attack my character.  If I had given out lies and you caught them, it would be a different story.  As for now, I have not lied once. 
So math and science is hard for you, that is ok scepti.  But refrain from attacking others when they confuse you.  You only make yourself look like an ass.

BTW, do you know what is involved in what I have said?  No? I didn't think so.  What makes you think I haven't had a second monitor open, and in between rearranging circuit pathways on a board layout I don't decide to post something?  For now I am stuck using an Eagle layout program that USM provided to me while I was going to school, so when you do test and export the file to board layout format it takes a bit of processing, especially when you are dealing with multi layered boards.  So I spend a bit of time on the computer and yeah, I have time to put in a word from time to time.   
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Yendor on June 29, 2015, 02:58:09 PM
Well it's Monday, I am at work.  I was a little busy Sunday and I wasn't here.  If i decide to take a break and sit down and look at what is being said I will.  Once again, I have given you no reason to call me a liar.  You just can't argue against me so your only option is to attack my character.  If I had given out lies and you caught them, it would be a different story.  As for now, I have not lied once. 
So math and science is hard for you, that is ok scepti.  But refrain from attacking others when they confuse you.  You only make yourself look like an ass.

BTW, do you know what is involved in what I have said?  No? I didn't think so.  What makes you think I haven't had a second monitor open, and in between rearranging circuit pathways on a board layout I don't decide to post something?  For now I am stuck using an Eagle layout program that USM provided to me while I was going to school, so when you do test and export the file to board layout format it takes a bit of processing, especially when you are dealing with multi layered boards.  So I spend a bit of time on the computer and yeah, I have time to put in a word from time to time.

Mikey T.,

Glad to see you back on. I didn't know you could lay out PC boards. I could have used an extra one at my last job where I was the engineering manager. Too bad, then you could have a real job. As a side note. Blue tape goes on one side and red tape goes on the other.

Yendor
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Mikey T. on June 29, 2015, 03:15:45 PM
Nope, not gonna acid etch my on boards, if this is what you are referring to on the tape.  I have used a copper mill to cut double sided boards.  I usually just lay out the boards after fighting wires and through pin chips on a breadboard, then lay out the circuit board in Eagle (BTW they have a huge downloadable library of actual footprints for the parts if you know what specific ones you are using, or you can design your own library if you can't find one, I had to for some surface mount atmel chips), adding any layers to reduce the size of the board, then once I am satisfied and it passes the emulation testing I export it to a layout file and submit it to Osha Park.  They are very friendly to small scale operations such as prototyping boards.  Cheaper to order enough to fill a 10 by 20 inch sheet though. 
Cadsoft make Eagle, you can check them out here, but I am not sure how scaled down the trial software may be.  I think it will only let you make something like a 2 inch by 2 inch board.  Also another decent free CAD circuit program is PSpice.  This is what almost of the circuits I had to design in school used to emulate it, but i do not think is hase board layout tools, not sure on that, but i prefer it for testing initial circuit ideas so you can get an ideal readings for any node in the circuit.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Yendor on June 29, 2015, 03:19:51 PM
Quote
You see, if your body receives as low as 1mA for one second, given high enough voltage you could be killed.
So, what sort of voltage are we talking here then Yendor?  And I'll ask again: citation.
[/quote]

Jimmy,

If a body resistance is low enough and 1mA could pass through his heart a person could die. Especially those with weak hearts. I never said,"if you get shocked for 1 second 1mA would kill you". I simply said, "1ma for one second can kill". A bright guy like yourself should have figured that out.

Have you read were solar panels produce voltage yet?

Yendor
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: modestman on June 29, 2015, 03:22:14 PM
Yendor you are very good man don't listen to inferior mind and man like mikey he is scientist mind the most inferior mind, Yendor you came from the industry and you are honest man very honest, live your life with proud and let mike live with regrets.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: sokarul on June 29, 2015, 03:25:51 PM
Since I didn't get online much yesterday or today, I will answer Yendor really quickly here.  First I never claimed to be some electronics genius.  I did point out your obvious lack of understanding or your purposeful act of ignorance of basic electrical concepts.  Yes I did work as a DirecTV installer for several years, I also was a regional trainer for installers and I traveled to other areas of the country to certify installers.  I am currently not working in a constant engineering field, yet I did just recently graduate with two degrees in engineering (computer and electronics).  I do some consulting work for automation systems for the company I currently work for in addition to my responsibilities as a manager in materials movement.  I do a little side projects in electronics to keep my skills fresh like designing custom home automation systems.  I have a couple of base units that I am in the process of developing to patent for a new project involving home automation.  If I do succeed in getting the patent pending, I will then provide you with plenty of data involving it. 
I believe if you are going to claim to be an engineer, you must know the basic concepts of the engineering field and physics.  So when i see someone claiming such and then spouting complete nonsense I will in fact call you out.  I sacrificed way too much earning my degrees (almost put myself, my wife and my kids into homeless status to do so) to see someone shit all over the profession.
Stop telling so many lies. If you were doing all that, I guarantee you, you wouldn't be sat on here spewing your shit.
Get a grip. Only the really naive one's will fall for your utter bullshit. There's some global Earther's that fit the bill. Pm them and spew your nonsense. I'm sure you can fathom who the gullible one's are.
Take your own advice.

Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Yendor on June 29, 2015, 03:27:34 PM
Nope, not gonna acid etch my on boards, if this is what you are referring to on the tape.  I have used a copper mill to cut double sided boards.  I usually just lay out the boards after fighting wires and through pin chips on a breadboard, then lay out the circuit board in Eagle (BTW they have a huge downloadable library of actual footprints for the parts if you know what specific ones you are using, or you can design your own library if you can't find one, I had to for some surface mount atmel chips), adding any layers to reduce the size of the board, then once I am satisfied and it passes the emulation testing I export it to a layout file and submit it to Osha Park.  They are very friendly to small scale operations such as prototyping boards.  Cheaper to order enough to fill a 10 by 20 inch sheet though. 
Cadsoft make Eagle, you can check them out here, but I am not sure how scaled down the trial software may be.  I think it will only let you make something like a 2 inch by 2 inch board.  Also another decent free CAD circuit program is PSpice.  This is what almost of the circuits I had to design in school used to emulate it, but i do not think is hase board layout tools, not sure on that, but i prefer it for testing initial circuit ideas so you can get an ideal readings for any node in the circuit.

Mikey T.,

I always use a company called ExpressPCB for prototype boards I did at home. They have a free program you design the schematic with and another free program that  does the actual board. You should check them out. I believe this is the first time you've been civil to me. Thanks.

Yendor
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: sceptimatic on June 29, 2015, 03:31:41 PM
I'm starting to think scepti's shtick is best read as a rap.  Try reading this in your best gangsta stylee:

Stop telling so many lies. It's this I tell you, that I despise.
If you were doing all that, I guarantee you, crabs, that it's a rap.
You wouldn't be sat on here spewing your shit. You'd see the light and join the gangster hit.
Get a grip. Accept no stick. Let's have the rip.
Only the really naive one's will fall for your utter bullshit. No nit pick, it's real slick, don't set up lip.
There's some global Earther's that fit the bill. Play it cool it's blue or red pill, don't shill, just go in for the thrill and chill.
Pm them and spew your nonsense. Show them who's boss and curb the bad sense.
I'm sure you can fathom who the gullible one's are. Sell them holes with rust for a car. Never leave the door ajar for fear of infiltration from afar, just don't let it mar your experience of the la de dah.




Or maybe there isn't enough rhyming - maybe spoken word poetry?
Try that out crabby and sing it like a gangster rapper.  :P
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Mikey T. on June 29, 2015, 03:40:28 PM
Nope, not gonna acid etch my on boards, if this is what you are referring to on the tape.  I have used a copper mill to cut double sided boards.  I usually just lay out the boards after fighting wires and through pin chips on a breadboard, then lay out the circuit board in Eagle (BTW they have a huge downloadable library of actual footprints for the parts if you know what specific ones you are using, or you can design your own library if you can't find one, I had to for some surface mount atmel chips), adding any layers to reduce the size of the board, then once I am satisfied and it passes the emulation testing I export it to a layout file and submit it to Osha Park.  They are very friendly to small scale operations such as prototyping boards.  Cheaper to order enough to fill a 10 by 20 inch sheet though. 
Cadsoft make Eagle, you can check them out here, but I am not sure how scaled down the trial software may be.  I think it will only let you make something like a 2 inch by 2 inch board.  Also another decent free CAD circuit program is PSpice.  This is what almost of the circuits I had to design in school used to emulate it, but i do not think is hase board layout tools, not sure on that, but i prefer it for testing initial circuit ideas so you can get an ideal readings for any node in the circuit.

Mikey T.,

I always use a company called ExpressPCB for prototype boards I did at home. They have a free program you design the schematic with and another free program that  does the actual board. You should check them out. I believe this is the first time you've been civil to me. Thanks.

Yendor
Not completely true there, we had a nice conversation about atmospheric bounce and the frequencies that the ionosphere would reflect.  I think your point was that the Satellite signals could bounce back, and mine was that microwaves were too short a wavelength to do so. 
modestman, please stray away from the conversation, as you have no idea what you are talking about.
But yes Yendor, I will try to be more civil towards you.  Like I said, I sacrificed way too much to see engineering get crapped on.  Whether you were intending on that being your message or not, I took it that way. 
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: charles bloomington on June 29, 2015, 04:28:14 PM
You don't even need 1mA . Volts alone is sufficient if you have a magnesium deficiency or other form of electrolyte imbalance .
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Yendor on June 29, 2015, 04:42:36 PM
You don't even need 1mA . Volts alone is sufficient if you have a magnesium deficiency or other form of electrolyte imbalance .


Which I do.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Mikey T. on June 29, 2015, 04:54:50 PM
Voltage is not what will kill you.  But, with high voltage and a low body resistance you can actually get a high enough current to flow through your body to possibly kill you.  It is rather rare to see a body with a low enough resistance to actually have all the factors in place for such a thing to do, and it still needs to cross your heart.  So I guess i am sorta agreeing with charles on this.  Crap, I need to go wash my hands, I feel dirty now.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Yendor on June 29, 2015, 05:04:19 PM
Nope, not gonna acid etch my on boards, if this is what you are referring to on the tape.  I have used a copper mill to cut double sided boards.  I usually just lay out the boards after fighting wires and through pin chips on a breadboard, then lay out the circuit board in Eagle (BTW they have a huge downloadable library of actual footprints for the parts if you know what specific ones you are using, or you can design your own library if you can't find one, I had to for some surface mount atmel chips), adding any layers to reduce the size of the board, then once I am satisfied and it passes the emulation testing I export it to a layout file and submit it to Osha Park.  They are very friendly to small scale operations such as prototyping boards.  Cheaper to order enough to fill a 10 by 20 inch sheet though. 
Cadsoft make Eagle, you can check them out here, but I am not sure how scaled down the trial software may be.  I think it will only let you make something like a 2 inch by 2 inch board.  Also another decent free CAD circuit program is PSpice.  This is what almost of the circuits I had to design in school used to emulate it, but i do not think is hase board layout tools, not sure on that, but i prefer it for testing initial circuit ideas so you can get an ideal readings for any node in the circuit.

Mikey T.,

I always use a company called ExpressPCB for prototype boards I did at home. They have a free program you design the schematic with and another free program that  does the actual board. You should check them out. I believe this is the first time you've been civil to me. Thanks.

Yendor
Not completely true there, we had a nice conversation about atmospheric bounce and the frequencies that the ionosphere would reflect.  I think your point was that the Satellite signals could bounce back, and mine was that microwaves were too short a wavelength to do so. 
modestman, please stray away from the conversation, as you have no idea what you are talking about.
But yes Yendor, I will try to be more civil towards you.  Like I said, I sacrificed way too much to see engineering get crapped on.  Whether you were intending on that being your message or not, I took it that way.

Mikey T.

Yes we did, I now remember that. I was basically saying that it is possible to bounce waves off the ionosphere that was in the Ghz range. It depended on the angle  of the wave. Basically the wider the angle the higher the frequency. Most of what you read says 30mhz is the limit. Any higher the signal would pass through the ionosphere. The point I was trying to make was if you aimed a dish at that point in the sky you would be able to receive the TV signal. Not from a satellite but from the sky. It was an old research paper that was written long before satellites came into existence. I know I was very surprised  when I read it. I know when I was young I had an old CB transceiver and I could talk skip on a lot of nights.

I feel the same about electronics as you do. I knew when I was very young I wanted to learn about TVs. When the TV service man came to our house to replace a tube I couldn't wait until I could see inside when he took the back off. My whole life has been working on cars, Mechanical design and electronic design. Good talking with you.

Yendor

Yendor
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Mikey T. on June 29, 2015, 05:05:12 PM
Since we are talking all nice to each other, I will give you a hint as to my current roadblock on one of my designs.  I am trying to initiate a large enough current from a door opening as to send a signal to a base station without the use of a battery or power supply.  I have tried high rated capacitors, I am just having some issues with the inductive charge of a magnetic strip moving against another one to form enough charge.  I am looking at using two semiconductors an N and a P with them making contact when the door is closed but when it is open the charge should build due to the gap between them.  However, if I could use the door being closed in a way to keep an air gap between the two then they make momentary contact as the door opens, I can create a larger charge to be sent from the N material to the cap and thus enough charge to send a signal burst out to the base unit. 
I would rather keep it in the magnetic induction type model as the lifetime of the device would increase and my costs would go down.  Much better compromise, but as of yet I have not been able to get enough charge to initiate the signal in a way that can be picked up at the base unit.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: modestman on June 29, 2015, 05:07:50 PM
There are two options of microwave:
1)they are not bumping any signals through the ionosphere - it's simple long range waves and there is no curvature
2)they bump it through the upper earth, the earth above us which its bottom is what we call the firmament or dome.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Mikey T. on June 29, 2015, 05:10:09 PM
True enough, but 30kHz is the very upper limit for a signal bounce, it works much better down in the 10 kHz range.  The signal being received at the dish is in fact in the Ka to Ku band though meaning between the 12 to 30ish GHz.  Although the middle of the K band is right at the resonant frequency of water, so anything with a wide enough rain droplet as to be a bit above 1 cm gets absorbed by the rain droplet.  The more rain, the more signal gets absorbed, i.e. Rain fade for satellites. 
But no need to go back into that discussion here, I think we both left that one on good terms.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Yendor on June 29, 2015, 05:14:00 PM
Voltage is not what will kill you.  But, with high voltage and a low body resistance you can actually get a high enough current to flow through your body to possibly kill you.  It is rather rare to see a body with a low enough resistance to actually have all the factors in place for such a thing to do, and it still needs to cross your heart.  So I guess i am sorta agreeing with charles on this.  Crap, I need to go wash my hands, I feel dirty now.

Mikey T.,

The current doesn't have to be that high. Just 1mA or less can cause your heart to stop, If the current passes you heart.

Yendor
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Yendor on June 29, 2015, 05:15:51 PM
True enough, but 30kHz is the very upper limit for a signal bounce, it works much better down in the 10 kHz range.  The signal being received at the dish is in fact in the Ka to Ku band though meaning between the 12 to 30ish GHz.  Although the middle of the K band is right at the resonant frequency of water, so anything with a wide enough rain droplet as to be a bit above 1 cm gets absorbed by the rain droplet.  The more rain, the more signal gets absorbed, i.e. Rain fade for satellites. 
But no need to go back into that discussion here, I think we both left that one on good terms.

Right you are.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Mikey T. on June 29, 2015, 05:17:16 PM
There are two options of microwave:
1)they are not bumping any signals through the ionosphere - it's simple long range waves and there is no curvature
2)they bump it through the upper earth, the earth above us which its bottom is what we call the firmament or dome.
Well they do not work that way.  The receiving antenna has to be precisely pointed at one spot in the sky, and you can actually play around with blocking it from every side except directly in the signal path.  This will show it to be a LOS signal.  Meaning it is on a straight path from the sky.  This rules out terrestrial broadcast direct to the receiver. 
As far as bouncing it, using geometry, you would not be able to have all Receiver dishes point at the same relative spot in the sky to receive it unless you have almost as many broadcast locations situated all over the place.  When i was working for them, I could set up two dishes around 100 miles apart and have a very very similar setup on both.  This means the location is relatively far away.  With a bounce effect I would need two separate broadcast locations to hit these two receiving locations. 
Sorry, it has been proposed before, but just will not work.   
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: JerkFace on June 29, 2015, 05:20:36 PM
Since we are talking all nice to each other, I will give you a hint as to my current roadblock on one of my designs.  I am trying to initiate a large enough current from a door opening as to send a signal to a base station without the use of a battery or power supply.  I have tried high rated capacitors, I am just having some issues with the inductive charge of a magnetic strip moving against another one to form enough charge.  I am looking at using two semiconductors an N and a P with them making contact when the door is closed but when it is open the charge should build due to the gap between them.  However, if I could use the door being closed in a way to keep an air gap between the two then they make momentary contact as the door opens, I can create a larger charge to be sent from the N material to the cap and thus enough charge to send a signal burst out to the base unit. 
I would rather keep it in the magnetic induction type model as the lifetime of the device would increase and my costs would go down.  Much better compromise, but as of yet I have not been able to get enough charge to initiate the signal in a way that can be picked up at the base unit.

Good to see Yendor come clean at last.    I'd stick with the magnets and coils  ( aka generator ) design for your door,  but I'd put it over on the hinge line where you have a mechanical advantage and gear it up to spin a little generator.   If you are looking for small generators,  try testing some small low voltage dc motors.   

For PCB design,  we used Altium  ( used to be protel )  for years,  since I retired I do consulting work,  when the job is interesting enough, and the money worth while.  So I still use Altium,  and I get boards made in china,  4 layer boards,  excellent quality,  unbelievable prices,  and quick turnaround.    All smt these days,  and enough 0.5mm pitch ic's to test the eyesight to the limit.

Yendor, 

I'm still waiting for you to tell me what part of the solar panel the astronaut would get a shock from.   Also waiting on a citation for the 1ma can kill claim. 
When you've answered those questions,  you can tell me why you think the ISS is fake,   but I want to see evidence to support your belief.


Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Mikey T. on June 29, 2015, 05:27:01 PM
Voltage is not what will kill you.  But, with high voltage and a low body resistance you can actually get a high enough current to flow through your body to possibly kill you.  It is rather rare to see a body with a low enough resistance to actually have all the factors in place for such a thing to do, and it still needs to cross your heart.  So I guess i am sorta agreeing with charles on this.  Crap, I need to go wash my hands, I feel dirty now.

Mikey T.,

The current doesn't have to be that high. Just 1mA or less can cause your heart to stop, If the current passes you heart.

Yendor
I have to disagree with you on the figure there slightly.  it really needs to be closer to 10mA before your muscles cannot operate.  That being said, I think with the heart it could probably, with a defective or "older" heart, maybe get down to 5mA crossing the heart to stop it from beating.  I only say this as the heart muscle is pretty finely tuned (thanks God, its a genius machine).
But we are splitting hairs to a point.  The more resistance your body has the lower the current will be as it gets closer to the core of your body, i.e. heart muscle.  This depends on the path it takes also as the path the electricity will take would be the least resistance one, if that is through your arm down to your foot, it most likely wont cross your heart if the current is not really high. 
Current is just moving of electrons, this one pushing that one out of its location, leaving a positive or no charge to be more specific, so on and so forth.  The easier it is to push the next electron out of its "area" the higher the current will be and it will move in that direction.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Mikey T. on June 29, 2015, 05:35:05 PM
Well I am trying to "dummy proof' a device to be attached to the door and door frame.  I want the skill level for the installation to be rather low end as it were. 
Not to get too in depth in the design, I am working on making a DIY kit for home automation.  The system can work with cameras, lighting control and security.  I have everything from the cellphone app to the base units for everything prototyped and working pretty well except for the door and window intrusion devices. 
Once I can hammer that part down and be low impact enough, i.e. aesthetics, I will take it to the next step of trying to get backing.  I am toying with the kickstarter idea, but I prefer to have my designs protected first.  So gotta make it work, then submit the finished designs etc. 
 
edit**  So what is patent worthy of my designs, well think of the embedded system being in the base unit being modular.  And there is a bit in the signals being used and how the embedded system provides security on those signals.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: modestman on June 29, 2015, 05:40:43 PM
Since we are talking all nice to each other, I will give you a hint as to my current roadblock on one of my designs.  I am trying to initiate a large enough current from a door opening as to send a signal to a base station without the use of a battery or power supply.  I have tried high rated capacitors, I am just having some issues with the inductive charge of a magnetic strip moving against another one to form enough charge.  I am looking at using two semiconductors an N and a P with them making contact when the door is closed but when it is open the charge should build due to the gap between them.  However, if I could use the door being closed in a way to keep an air gap between the two then they make momentary contact as the door opens, I can create a larger charge to be sent from the N material to the cap and thus enough charge to send a signal burst out to the base unit. 
I would rather keep it in the magnetic induction type model as the lifetime of the device would increase and my costs would go down.  Much better compromise, but as of yet I have not been able to get enough charge to initiate the signal in a way that can be picked up at the base unit.

Good to see Yendor come clean at last.    I'd stick with the magnets and coils  ( aka generator ) design for your door,  but I'd put it over on the hinge line where you have a mechanical advantage and gear it up to spin a little generator.   If you are looking for small generators,  try testing some small low voltage dc motors.   

For PCB design,  we used Altium  ( used to be protel )  for years,  since I retired I do consulting work,  when the job is interesting enough, and the money worth while.  So I still use Altium,  and I get boards made in china,  4 layer boards,  excellent quality,  unbelievable prices,  and quick turnaround.    All smt these days,  and enough 0.5mm pitch ic's to test the eyesight to the limit.

Yendor, 

I'm still waiting for you to tell me what part of the solar panel the astronaut would get a shock from.   Also waiting on a citation for the 1ma can kill claim. 
When you've answered those questions,  you can tell me why you think the ISS is fake,   but I want to see evidence to support your belief.
people lies a lot, a lot, look at news, why NAZA wouldn't lie ?
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: JerkFace on June 29, 2015, 05:43:35 PM
Well I am trying to "dummy proof' a device to be attached to the door and door frame.  I want the skill level for the installation to be rather low end as it were. 
Not to get too in depth in the design, I am working on making a DIY kit for home automation.  The system can work with cameras, lighting control and security.  I have everything from the cellphone app to the base units for everything prototyped and working pretty well except for the door and window intrusion devices. 
Once I can hammer that part down and be low impact enough, i.e. aesthetics, I will take it to the next step of trying to get backing.  I am toying with the kickstarter idea, but I prefer to have my designs protected first.  So gotta make it work, then submit the finished designs etc.

There is plenty of mechanical energy there,  so it's just a matter of coming up with a means of converting enough to power a small transmitter,   I have seen designs for piezo clickers that transmit car door type rolling codes,   and an IR one I think? 

Here ..
http://techon.nikkeibp.co.jp/english/NEWS_EN/20091117/177713/ (http://techon.nikkeibp.co.jp/english/NEWS_EN/20091117/177713/)

As the door or window opens it clicks the piezo and transmits the code.    Well,  it's an idea ;D

Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: sokarul on June 29, 2015, 05:44:13 PM
Since we are talking all nice to each other, I will give you a hint as to my current roadblock on one of my designs.  I am trying to initiate a large enough current from a door opening as to send a signal to a base station without the use of a battery or power supply.  I have tried high rated capacitors, I am just having some issues with the inductive charge of a magnetic strip moving against another one to form enough charge.  I am looking at using two semiconductors an N and a P with them making contact when the door is closed but when it is open the charge should build due to the gap between them.  However, if I could use the door being closed in a way to keep an air gap between the two then they make momentary contact as the door opens, I can create a larger charge to be sent from the N material to the cap and thus enough charge to send a signal burst out to the base unit. 
I would rather keep it in the magnetic induction type model as the lifetime of the device would increase and my costs would go down.  Much better compromise, but as of yet I have not been able to get enough charge to initiate the signal in a way that can be picked up at the base unit.
ummm can't just do a gear setup like this?
http://techxplore.com/news/2015-06-students-germ-free-door.html (http://techxplore.com/news/2015-06-students-germ-free-door.html)
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Mikey T. on June 29, 2015, 05:46:24 PM
Exactly piezoelectric is what I am looking at currently with the N and P materials portion. 
http://www.news.gatech.edu/features/harvesting-worlds-mechanical-energy (http://www.news.gatech.edu/features/harvesting-worlds-mechanical-energy)

Sok, I haven't looked into replacing the hardware on the door like that yet.  Interesting option though, I will have to read that completely, I just skimmed it for a minute or so.
** edited a typo
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: sokarul on June 29, 2015, 05:49:14 PM
Exactly piezo is what I am looking at currently with the N and P materials portion. 
http://www.news.gatech.edu/features/harvesting-worlds-mechanical-energy (http://www.news.gatech.edu/features/harvesting-worlds-mechanical-energy)

Sok, I haven't looked into replacing the hardware on the door like that yet.  interesting option though, I will have to read that completely, I just skimmed it for a minute or so.
It doesn't say how to do it, they just supposedly have enough power from the door's movement to power a UV light.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: JerkFace on June 29, 2015, 05:53:06 PM
Exactly piezo is what I am looking at currently with the N and P materials portion. 
http://www.news.gatech.edu/features/harvesting-worlds-mechanical-energy (http://www.news.gatech.edu/features/harvesting-worlds-mechanical-energy)

Sok, I haven't looked into replacing the hardware on the door like that yet.  interesting option though, I will have to read that completely, I just skimmed it for a minute or so.

Interesting idea for a door handle,   could be a winner for hospitals and nursing homes and the like. 

TI have an energy harvesting kit,   http://au.mouser.com/applications/energy_harvesting_solar/ (http://au.mouser.com/applications/energy_harvesting_solar/)     might give you some ideas about low light level solar panels.   You can get solar panels that will work with very low ambient light levels.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Mikey T. on June 29, 2015, 05:58:22 PM
Well, I did look into having the door's movement charge a capacitor over time, but if I could just get enough current off of just one door opening event, then I could just keep all the intrusion detection being done safely at the base station and the door or window device would not have to know whether or not it was armed or not.  Windows would be easier to a point using a small solar cell and a standard contact strip.  Excuse the pun, but I am stuck in the doorway area.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: modestman on June 29, 2015, 06:01:38 PM
JROA please stop their spamming.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: JerkFace on June 29, 2015, 06:11:53 PM
Well, I did look into having the door's movement charge a capacitor over time, but if I could just get enough current off of just one door opening event, then I could just keep all the intrusion detection being done safely at the base station and the door or window device would not have to know whether or not it was armed or not.  Windows would be easier to a point using a small solar cell and a standard contact strip.  Excuse the pun, but I am stuck in the doorway area.

I think it's going to be a case of build a few prototypes,  starting with the lowest power transmitter and microcontroller you can get away with,  and then coming up with the energy harvesting system that fits the product profile.    Just as an aside are you familiar with microchip's  keeloq product range?
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Mikey T. on June 29, 2015, 06:26:14 PM
As for Keeloq, very little. 
I do have to have enough power to get beyond the noise, i.e. EMI and RFI that may be in the range of low power signals.  I also have to have an ID in the signal to be able to differentiate what access point has been triggered. 
Like I said, it is a work in progress, I have tried several different versions.

modestman, I am sorry if this is boring to you, or you cannot understand what we are talking about.  Yes we have diverged  a great deal from the OP.  So I will try to back out of the conversation.  This is just what is currently on my mind fairly heavily for while i am not at work.  It is nice to get others opinions too.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: JerkFace on June 29, 2015, 06:30:15 PM
As for Keeloq, very little. 
I do have to have enough power to get beyond the noise, i.e. EMI and RFI that may be in the range of low power signals.  I also have to have an ID in the signal to be able to differentiate what access point has been triggered. 
Like I said, it is a work in progress, I have tried several different versions.

modestman, I am sorry if this is boring to you, or you cannot understand what we are talking about.  Yes we have diverged  a great deal from the OP.  So I will try to back out of the conversation.  This is just what is currently on my mind fairly heavily for while i am not at work.  It is nice to get others opinions too.

modestman just wants to get back to insulting everyone.   I'd ignore him.

My current consulting work is the opposite end of the scale,  at least as far as power is concerned,  it's designing 10 KW off grid solar systems.   

Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: guv on June 29, 2015, 08:17:29 PM
As for Keeloq, very little. 
I do have to have enough power to get beyond the noise, i.e. EMI and RFI that may be in the range of low power signals.  I also have to have an ID in the signal to be able to differentiate what access point has been triggered. 
Like I said, it is a work in progress, I have tried several different versions.

modestman, I am sorry if this is boring to you, or you cannot understand what we are talking about.  Yes we have diverged  a great deal from the OP.  So I will try to back out of the conversation.  This is just what is currently on my mind fairly heavily for while i am not at work.  It is nice to get others opinions too.

modestman just wants to get back to insulting everyone.   I'd ignore him.

My current consulting work is the opposite end of the scale,  at least as far as power is concerned,  it's designing 10 KW off grid solar systems.


Don't tell Tony Rabbit you do solar. Want an offsider?.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Yendor on June 30, 2015, 08:02:56 AM
Since we are talking all nice to each other, I will give you a hint as to my current roadblock on one of my designs.  I am trying to initiate a large enough current from a door opening as to send a signal to a base station without the use of a battery or power supply.  I have tried high rated capacitors, I am just having some issues with the inductive charge of a magnetic strip moving against another one to form enough charge.  I am looking at using two semiconductors an N and a P with them making contact when the door is closed but when it is open the charge should build due to the gap between them.  However, if I could use the door being closed in a way to keep an air gap between the two then they make momentary contact as the door opens, I can create a larger charge to be sent from the N material to the cap and thus enough charge to send a signal burst out to the base unit. 
I would rather keep it in the magnetic induction type model as the lifetime of the device would increase and my costs would go down.  Much better compromise, but as of yet I have not been able to get enough charge to initiate the signal in a way that can be picked up at the base unit.

Mikey T.

Why not use the same kind of device they use for tool roads. In my are it called EZPass. The device in the car has no battery. The device sends out an RF signal that turns on the device in the car and then the device transmits a digital signal over an RF carrier that transmits the persons info to the control center. The distance these devices work is pretty far. In fact you can wire an entire factory using this method. If this won't work, give me more information of your requirement.

Yendor
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Yendor on June 30, 2015, 08:17:45 AM

Yendor, 

I'm still waiting for you to tell me what part of the solar panel the astronaut would get a shock from.   Also waiting on a citation for the 1ma can kill claim. 
When you've answered those questions,  you can tell me why you think the ISS is fake,   but I want to see evidence to support your belief.
[/quote]


Rayzor,

Jimmy,

If a body resistance is low enough and 1mA could pass through his heart a person could die. Especially those with weak hearts. I never said,"if you get shocked for 1 second 1mA would kill you". I simply said, "1ma for one second can kill". A bright guy like yourself should have figured that out.

Have you read were solar panels produce voltage yet? If it is true you work around solar panels on do something with them, You should realize if you touch the negative and positive lead of a high wattage solar panel you could get shocked. If I'm wrong please explain why. I only expect it to happen. I've never worked with them at all.

Yendor

Yendor
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Mikey T. on June 30, 2015, 08:19:00 AM
Well, I could look into RFID tags like that, but it needs to be initiated from the door opening, I wasn't thinking about having the base station constantly polling the access points for updates.  I will look into it a bit more.  I did some research on RFID readers for another project during my senior year of college.  I designed a wall avoidance system for a quadcopter and the construction engineering guys wanted to add an RFID reader payload to it to present it as a cost effective inspection platform for large buildings, specifically concrete structures and their RFID tags attached to strain gauges inside the concrete and rebar.

Since you can use them to transmit data from sensors, I guess I could try to have it change its ID based on the status of the door/window.   But that means the base station would be polling constantly.  Gonna reduce the lifetime of my zigbee.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Yendor on June 30, 2015, 04:49:08 PM
Well, I could look into RFID tags like that, but it needs to be initiated from the door opening, I wasn't thinking about having the base station constantly polling the access points for updates.  I will look into it a bit more.  I did some research on RFID readers for another project during my senior year of college.  I designed a wall avoidance system for a quadcopter and the construction engineering guys wanted to add an RFID reader payload to it to present it as a cost effective inspection platform for large buildings, specifically concrete structures and their RFID tags attached to strain gauges inside the concrete and rebar.

Since you can use them to transmit data from sensors, I guess I could try to have it change its ID based on the status of the door/window.   But that means the base station would be polling constantly.  Gonna reduce the lifetime of my zigbee.

Mikey T.

Can you use a magnet and a NC reed switch that would open the reed when the door opens allowing a line to be pulled up via a pull up resistor. Use a large enough value resistor so you aren't drawing too much current across it. This would generate an interrupt to the processor. Then the NO side of the reed switch would complete the circuit for the RFID device. Then the processor would poll all the RFID devices to see which one generated the interrupt and will communicate. I guess you would only need one wire for ground. Is this any help?

Yendor
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Mikey T. on June 30, 2015, 06:17:44 PM
True, but I still would like to get it to being two little pieces that you could attach to the door and doorframe to make it as easy as possible for a person to install for themselves.  I will look into some of the suggestions I have received here, and thank you all for your input.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: JerkFace on June 30, 2015, 06:25:21 PM
Well, I could look into RFID tags like that, but it needs to be initiated from the door opening, I wasn't thinking about having the base station constantly polling the access points for updates.  I will look into it a bit more.  I did some research on RFID readers for another project during my senior year of college.  I designed a wall avoidance system for a quadcopter and the construction engineering guys wanted to add an RFID reader payload to it to present it as a cost effective inspection platform for large buildings, specifically concrete structures and their RFID tags attached to strain gauges inside the concrete and rebar.

Since you can use them to transmit data from sensors, I guess I could try to have it change its ID based on the status of the door/window.   But that means the base station would be polling constantly.  Gonna reduce the lifetime of my zigbee.

Mikey T.

Can you use a magnet and a NC reed switch that would open the reed when the door opens allowing a line to be pulled up via a pull up resistor. Use a large enough value resistor so you aren't drawing too much current across it. This would generate an interrupt to the processor. Then the NO side of the reed switch would complete the circuit for the RFID device. Then the processor would poll all the RFID devices to see which one generated the interrupt and will communicate. I guess you would only need one wire for ground. Is this any help?

Yendor

Yendor,    I think Mikey is more concerned with how to provide enough power to transmit the door/window status,  that just simply detecting open/closed.   In any event security systems often don't just use digital open/closed type inputs,  the ones I've worked with are analog inputs, and measure the current through the switch/sensor  to detect tampering,  for example a burglar tries to bypass the switch with a short cct,  you can detect that by sensing increased current, just as easily as an open cct.   

Mikey,   I've used zigbee,  in both point to point and mesh configurations,  I think you'll find it tricky to get enough power,  even with a sleeping end-point configuration.    I've only ever used that with batteries,  and solar,   There are other wireless options,  but it depends how far down the track you are with zigbee.   If you haven't already committed to zigbee,  you might look at wifi using ESP8266 or similar.

Yendor,   Solar panels are fully insulated on all sides including terminals,  if you were to come in contact with the exposed cabling from a string of panels in series then you'd have to break through an enclosure to do so.   The danger of an astronaut on the ISS getting electrocuted by solar panels is vanishingly small.   Even if they took the covers of the junction boxes, they are wearing gloves which would provide some insulation.   They could climb all over the panels themselves and not get zapped,  but,  I'd guess they might mechanically damage the panels. 

Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Mikey T. on June 30, 2015, 07:43:02 PM
Yes, But zigbee gives me a bit more flexibility with the coding of ID in the signals so I don't have any crossover from the neighbors house or interference from an internet wifi present in the house or the neighbors.  Plus there are smart bulbs and smart plugs already on the market that could be incorporated into the monitoring and control from the system.  I do have a few Z-wave chips (love free samples), I have thought about bluetooth also, and wifi just has too many issues and a little higher on power consumption, I think. 
I am thinking on making a secondary receiver for just the door and window access point devices that just awaits a burst type transmission on a fairly low frequency while keeping the overall system on zigbee for expandability with other market items.  The main issue there would be noise levels.

See, I am still getting sucked back into this discussion lol.  Well I tried modestman, I really did.  I just can't help myself when it comes to this type of stuff. 
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Mikey T. on June 30, 2015, 07:47:03 PM
And yes you are correct, I have a multitude of different style sensor types that I could use for the door and windows, my main concern is the power for the signal broadcast.  I was toying with the idea of having the sensor be able to generate enough power from the mechanical movement of the door to send its own signal out.
Yeah i am trying to cheat a bit by not having anything to read the sensor then send the signal out.  My thoughts were if the sensor was passive and the movement of the door would generate enough power then I would not need a sensor and transmitter, the power from the movement would activate the transmitter.  I guess that makes sense.
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: JerkFace on June 30, 2015, 08:28:41 PM
There are a lot of solutions in that  application space,  short  range low power sensing.    I've used zigbee,  and you can make battery powered end-points with nano-watt level power consumption,  but when they wake up and transmit,  you need 20 mA or so,  that's a problem if you don't have batteries.   

The ESP8266 with it's built in tcp/ip stack and low power modes will integrate more easily with smart phones, tablets and allow remote internet access more easily.   Cheap as chips too.

The microchip keeloq system is low power rolling code transmitter,   like car door lock systems.   Is potentially the cheapest and lowest power option.  But development time is probably longer, and integration with existing systems would be problematic.

I mostly use microchip pic stuff,  but  lately  doing a lot of interface boards with the Intel Edison,  I like it better than raspberry pi.

Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Yendor on July 01, 2015, 06:36:10 AM
Rayzor,
Thanks for the info on solar panels. I guess I was speaking out of turn because I never have really worked with them.

Yendor
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: Yendor on July 01, 2015, 06:49:12 AM
Mikey T.

Is there anyway you could use a coiled spring that would unwind when the door or window opens. the spring would be connected to a small generated. That may give enough time to generate a code. A knob on the front would wind the spring back up. It is going to be hard to do without batteries.

Yendor
Title: Re: What About The ISS?
Post by: 11cookeaw1 on July 03, 2015, 12:25:45 AM


400km  is 1312336 ft.  Here is a photo at 120000 ft http://swns.com/wp-content/themes/wp-clear/scripts/timthumb.php?src=http://swns.com/wp-content/uploads/rower1-1024x768.jpg&w=600&h=450&zc=1 (http://swns.com/wp-content/themes/wp-clear/scripts/timthumb.php?src=http://swns.com/wp-content/uploads/rower1-1024x768.jpg&w=600&h=450&zc=1)
Definite curve there.  Looks like the earth is round after all.
Tickets please .All aboard the bullshit train . Full streaming shit ahead. Anther supply rocket blows up . That makes 3 if you include the Russian.
What are they breathing up there . What are they eating  & drinking up there .  Dame that shitter must be backed up to the hill . You can only survive on fairy dust shit talk for so long . I, d be a little worried if I was one of those nasa astronaut actors . They might  just  have to take one for the team soon .


400km  is 1312336 ft.  Here is a photo at 120000 ft http://swns.com/wp-content/themes/wp-clear/scripts/timthumb.php?src=http://swns.com/wp-content/uploads/rower1-1024x768.jpg&w=600&h=450&zc=1 (http://swns.com/wp-content/themes/wp-clear/scripts/timthumb.php?src=http://swns.com/wp-content/uploads/rower1-1024x768.jpg&w=600&h=450&zc=1)
Definite curve there.  Looks like the earth is round after all.
Tickets please .All aboard the bullshit train . Full streaming shit ahead. Anther supply rocket blows up . That makes 3 if you include the Russian.
What are they breathing up there . What are they eating  & drinking up there .  Dame that shitter must be backed up to the hill . You can only survive on fairy dust shit talk for so long . I, d be a little worried if I was one of those nasa astronaut actors . They might  just  have to take one for the team soon .
I can clearly see a slight curvature there.
They breathe using spacesuits.