The Flat Earth Society

Flat Earth Discussion Boards => Flat Earth Debate => Topic started by: GoodPoint on September 08, 2008, 03:15:48 PM

Title: Explain this Picture
Post by: GoodPoint on September 08, 2008, 03:15:48 PM
Below is a picture I took on my recent trip to Europe. I see a curve, and unless the "ice wall" is in the middle of Northern Canada, then I don't see how this picture could make any sense unless the Earth is round. I made a straight line across the horizon so that you can compare it with the curve. Notice how the curve is easier to see the farther you are from your screen. This is why the Earth looks flat from up close (when you are standing on it).

Here is the picture:
 (http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l137/GrahamNificent/RoundEarth.jpg)
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: Sir_Drainsalot on September 08, 2008, 03:17:03 PM
The camera lens is causing a fisheye effect.
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: GoodPoint on September 08, 2008, 03:25:28 PM
The camera lens is causing a fisheye effect.
Did my own eyes make this same effect? The whole reason I took the picture was because I noticed that I could see the curvature of the earth.
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: Oscar Wilde on September 08, 2008, 03:29:56 PM
There certainly is a "curve", but that image is quite frankly innappropriate. This is a family friendly site. Take your smut elsewhere.
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: Roundy the Truthinessist on September 08, 2008, 03:33:34 PM
Guys, please stop trolling in the serious forums.
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: GoodPoint on September 08, 2008, 03:35:37 PM
The camera lens is causing a fisheye effect.
This person saw the right picture. If you are seeing anything else besides the Earth from an Airplane, you are not looking at the right picture.
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: Roundy the Truthinessist on September 08, 2008, 03:37:38 PM
Calm down, GoodPoint, they're just playing with you.
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: GoodPoint on September 08, 2008, 03:39:00 PM
Guys, please stop trolling in the serious forums.

Thank you. I changed it to an [IMG] code so that people will not have to be lazy and assume that it is a picture of anything other than a round earth seen from an airplane. So, again, who can explain it.

Anyone?
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: Roundy the Truthinessist on September 08, 2008, 03:40:33 PM
DrainCoverLover already did.
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: GoodPoint on September 08, 2008, 03:46:55 PM
DrainCoverLover already did.

And I made a counter-argument, which was ignored.

Ok, since you don't trust my eyes, here is another picture:
(http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l137/GrahamNificent/RoundEarth2.jpg)


This time, the horizon goes through the middle of the frame (and a little below), which means that if the fish-eye theory were true, it should appear straight (or perhaps slightly concave), yet I still see a convex curve. Please explain.
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: Roundy the Truthinessist on September 08, 2008, 03:54:23 PM
DrainCoverLover already did.

And I made a counter-argument, which was ignored.

Ok, since you don't trust my eyes, here is another picture:
(http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l137/GrahamNificent/RoundEarth2.jpg)


This time, the horizon goes through the middle of the frame (and a little below), which means that if the fish-eye theory were true, it should appear straight (or perhaps slightly concave), yet I still see a convex curve. Please explain.

It looks flat to me, but honestly the horizon line seems too indistinct to draw any real conclusions from it.  In both pictures.  Is it possible you only thought you could see the curvature because you thought you should have been able to?  At what height were these pictures taken?
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: GoodPoint on September 08, 2008, 03:59:03 PM
DrainCoverLover already did.

And I made a counter-argument, which was ignored.

Ok, since you don't trust my eyes, here is another picture:



This time, the horizon goes through the middle of the frame (and a little below), which means that if the fish-eye theory were true, it should appear straight (or perhaps slightly concave), yet I still see a convex curve. Please explain.

It looks flat to me, but honestly the horizon line seems too indistinct to draw any real conclusions from it.  In both pictures.  Is it possible you only thought you could see the curvature because you thought you should have been able to?  At what height were these pictures taken?
Is it possible I imagined it? Yes. But then why did you believe that the "fish-eye effect" argument was true? DrainCoverLover must have seen the curve to even bring up that argument.

As for the height, I have no idea. I was half asleep and just happened to look over and see this view.
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: Tom Bishop on September 08, 2008, 04:05:28 PM
It looks flat to me
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: GoodPoint on September 08, 2008, 04:12:09 PM
It looks flat to me
Eh...whatever.
If you're just going to deny what is in the picture, then there is no point for me to be here.
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: Raist on September 08, 2008, 04:29:54 PM
Well I'm glad to see you had the decency to link to an appropriate image after that smut fiasco.

As to this image, it really is flat looking. I'm not saying this for one side of the debate or the other, i just think it looks flat.
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: Parsifal on September 08, 2008, 07:58:26 PM
These images provide great evidence for the curvature of light rays.
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: zeroply on September 09, 2008, 03:03:43 PM

This time, the horizon goes through the middle of the frame (and a little below), which means that if the fish-eye theory were true, it should appear straight (or perhaps slightly concave), yet I still see a convex curve. Please explain.

The horizon IS straight in this picture. I just drew a line using MS Paint and it clearly matches the horizon. So by your own admission the fisheye theory must be true.

(http://img352.imageshack.us/img352/4595/flatlinerk2.jpg)

I think you're seeing what you want to see. Clearly I haven't modified your picture except the resolution maybe, and the line is a simple drag and drop deal.
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: Xander on September 09, 2008, 06:21:07 PM
These images provide great evidence for the curvature of light rays.

This quote proves that stupid people make up stuff to fit their version of the world instead of trying to understand the world.

Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: Oscar Wilde on September 09, 2008, 06:24:57 PM
These images provide great evidence for the curvature of light rays.
This quote proves that stupid people make up stuff to fit their version of the world instead of trying to understand the world.
I know. RET has some nerve, doesn't it?
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: Rig Navigator on September 09, 2008, 06:41:29 PM
These images provide great evidence for the curvature of light rays.
This quote proves that stupid people make up stuff to fit their version of the world instead of trying to understand the world.
I know. RET has some nerve, doesn't it?

No more than FE apparently.
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: Xander on September 09, 2008, 10:07:49 PM
These images provide great evidence for the curvature of light rays.
This quote proves that stupid people make up stuff to fit their version of the world instead of trying to understand the world.
I know. RET has some nerve, doesn't it?

I wasn't referring to either RET or FET in this case actually... the pictures aren't high enough quality to provide evidence of anything at all really.
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: WardoggKC130FE on September 10, 2008, 12:06:58 AM
Ok Im going to yell a little here so that everyone can hear me.



YOU CANNOT SEE THE CURVATURE OF THE EARTH FROM A COMMERCIAL AIRLINER.  CAN'T CAN'T CAN'T.  IT IS IMPOSSIBLE.   If you think you see a curve it is most likely because the window is causing it.  Either from the fuselage of the airplane being curved or the window itself for whatever reason.  End of story.

I have got more flight time at altitude than anyone on this board.  I guarantee it.
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: ﮎingulaЯiτy on September 10, 2008, 06:50:51 AM
Since, the delusional ones control reality the most, I will test their abilities in redefining flat with better pictures:
These are college students having fun like most people on this site. Not NASA.
http://www.srcf.ucam.org/~cuspaceflight/nova1selected/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_altitude_balloon
I also recommend
http://www.natrium42.com/halo/flight2/

(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2361/1777030642_5e100755bb_o.jpg)
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: zeroply on September 10, 2008, 02:32:57 PM
Ok Im going to yell a little here so that everyone can hear me.

YOU CANNOT SEE THE CURVATURE OF THE EARTH FROM A COMMERCIAL AIRLINER.  CAN'T CAN'T CAN'T.  IT IS IMPOSSIBLE.   If you think you see a curve it is most likely because the window is causing it.  Either from the fuselage of the airplane being curved or the window itself for whatever reason.  End of story.

I have got more flight time at altitude than anyone on this board.  I guarantee it.

Ahah!! I knew it! We just needed an RE backer to admit that cameras cannot be trusted.

This thread can be closed now.
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: Tom Bishop on September 10, 2008, 05:09:16 PM
Since, the delusional ones control reality the most, I will test their abilities in redefining flat with better pictures:
These are college students having fun like most people on this site. Not NASA.
http://www.srcf.ucam.org/~cuspaceflight/nova1selected/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_altitude_balloon
I also recommend
http://www.natrium42.com/halo/flight2/

(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2361/1777030642_5e100755bb_o.jpg)

At that altitude the dirigible is looking down at the sun's distinct circular spotlight shining upon the earth.
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: markjo on September 10, 2008, 07:47:41 PM
Since, the delusional ones control reality the most, I will test their abilities in redefining flat with better pictures:
These are college students having fun like most people on this site. Not NASA.
http://www.srcf.ucam.org/~cuspaceflight/nova1selected/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_altitude_balloon
I also recommend
http://www.natrium42.com/halo/flight2/

(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2361/1777030642_5e100755bb_o.jpg)

At that altitude the dirigible is looking down at the sun's distinct circular spotlight shining upon the earth.

Then why do we not see the day/night terminator?
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: Rig Navigator on September 10, 2008, 07:55:15 PM
That definitely doesn't look like the big cereal bowl that we were led to believe we would see from a balloon launched into the atmosphere...

Quote from: Rowbotham
(http://img139.imageshack.us/img139/4586/balloonridearticlevv8.jpg) (http://imageshack.us)
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: dyno on September 10, 2008, 08:04:45 PM
That's what happens when you talk out your arse.
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: Tom Bishop on September 11, 2008, 01:57:17 AM
Quote
Then why do we not see the day/night terminator?

Because the day/night terminator in FE is rounded.

At that kind of altitude we're looking down at the distinct circular spotlight of the sun's light.
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: Rig Navigator on September 11, 2008, 08:03:46 AM
Because the day/night terminator in FE is rounded.

At that kind of altitude we're looking down at the distinct circular spotlight of the sun's light.

But all of the shadows created by the cloud tops are going the same direction.  If we were looking at a significant portion of the "spotlight" you would see some variance in the direction of the shadows.
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: markjo on September 11, 2008, 02:59:14 PM
Quote
Then why do we not see the day/night terminator?

Because the day/night terminator in FE is rounded.

At that kind of altitude we're looking down at the distinct circular spotlight of the sun's light.

Tom, the day/night terminator is not a sharp, distinct line.  It's a wide gradient.  Have you ever heard of twilight?  Depending on your location, civil twilight can last 30 minutes or more.
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: LogicIsBetter on September 12, 2008, 08:16:52 PM
I posted a similar picture in this thread:

http://theflatearthsociety.org/forum/index.php?topic=22119.msg453322#msg453322 (http://theflatearthsociety.org/forum/index.php?topic=22119.msg453322#msg453322)

where there was a similar discussion to this one. 

The usual explanation is that the window is convex or the camera lens is a fisheye.
A more complicated explanation is that light bends due to something or other to do with electromagnetic acceleration.

In all honesty, you can't really debate a picture like this unless you know the focal length of the lens used to take the picture.  In my case, I did know, because at the time I took my picture, I only owned two lenses, neither of which was wide angle at all, let alone fisheye.

I would like to point out, however, that a piece of bent plexiglass is not the same thing as a lens.  I've never seen an airplane window that was truly convex, only possibly bent slightly.  We should easily be able to do experiments to determine if bent plexiglass causes any distortion of light.

Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: LogicIsBetter on September 12, 2008, 08:19:04 PM
These images provide great evidence for the curvature of light rays.

The appearance of flat horizons from windows is great evidence that convex eyeballs cause a distortion of the curved horizon making it appear flat to humans.



Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: JohnBreckman007 on September 12, 2008, 09:59:17 PM
Beautiful pictures guys!!!

the curve is obvious... but in FE that is the edge of the earth and that makes earth really small.... all the FE maps are wrong then  ???
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: Roundy the Truthinessist on September 12, 2008, 10:29:48 PM
Yes, it's true!  We don't have an accurate map.  :(
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: WardoggKC130FE on September 12, 2008, 10:30:47 PM
Damn underfunding.  Anyone care to donate to me so that I can map the earth?
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: Tom Bishop on September 13, 2008, 01:00:21 AM
Because the day/night terminator in FE is rounded.

At that kind of altitude we're looking down at the distinct circular spotlight of the sun's light.

But all of the shadows created by the cloud tops are going the same direction.  If we were looking at a significant portion of the "spotlight" you would see some variance in the direction of the shadows.

What the hell are you talking about? Stop posting.

Quote
Tom, the day/night terminator is not a sharp, distinct line.  It's a wide gradient.  Have you ever heard of twilight?  Depending on your location, civil twilight can last 30 minutes or more.

What makes you think that it would be a sharp line in the FE model?
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: markjo on September 13, 2008, 01:18:39 PM
Quote
Tom, the day/night terminator is not a sharp, distinct line.  It's a wide gradient.  Have you ever heard of twilight?  Depending on your location, civil twilight can last 30 minutes or more.

What makes you think that it would be a sharp line in the FE model?

(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2361/1777030642_5e100755bb_o.jpg)
At that altitude the dirigible is looking down at the sun's distinct circular spotlight shining upon the earth.

Let's see.  If the earth were flat, you should still be able to see some sort of detail in the background as the sunlight fades.  I only see atmospheric haze that appears to rise upwards, not a gradient of FE extending backwards.  So either the earth is flat and the sun's spotlight has a nice sharp edge, or the earth is round and the sun is still shining behind the horizon.
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: ghazwozza on September 13, 2008, 01:26:23 PM
Quote
But all of the shadows created by the cloud tops are going the same direction.  If we were looking at a significant portion of the "spotlight" you would see some variance in the direction of the shadows.

What the hell are you talking about? Stop posting.

You don't understand this? From the shadows of the cloyds we see that the light is consistently coming from the right of the picture. If we were looking at the spotlight, it would be coming from the top, with slight variation in angle.

This is not observed, so the spotlight theory is incorrect.
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: ﮎingulaЯiτy on September 13, 2008, 05:29:16 PM
Thanks guys for taking up the argument in my absence.  :)
I have little more to add, but it occurred to me that a this picture with the contrast boosted might prove useful in demonstrating the curvature of the horizon and drop off point under the atmosphere.

(http://i237.photobucket.com/albums/ff101/Yiak/Contrast.gif)
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: ﮎingulaЯiτy on September 13, 2008, 05:56:27 PM
That definitely doesn't look like the big cereal bowl that we were led to believe we would see from a balloon launched into the atmosphere...

The Earth's horizon and the Cloudline's horizon are much like concentric circles. The second circle is larger than the first and thus once penetrated, curvature temporarily becomes less obvious again. His observations were on a clear day so the cloud layer was not observed.
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: Tom Bishop on September 22, 2008, 07:52:18 AM
Quote
You don't understand this? From the shadows of the cloyds we see that the light is consistently coming from the right of the picture. If we were looking at the spotlight, it would be coming from the top, with slight variation in angle.

This is not observed, so the spotlight theory is incorrect.

It's impossible to even see the shadows of the clouds. I'm not sure what you're babbling about.

Quote
hanks guys for taking up the argument in my absence.
I have little more to add, but it occurred to me that a this picture with the contrast boosted might prove useful in demonstrating the curvature of the horizon and drop off point under the atmosphere.

Looks like you're adjusting the contrast of the spotlight sun to me.
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: Frost33 on September 22, 2008, 08:20:33 AM
Quote
You don't understand this? From the shadows of the cloyds we see that the light is consistently coming from the right of the picture. If we were looking at the spotlight, it would be coming from the top, with slight variation in angle.

This is not observed, so the spotlight theory is incorrect.

It's impossible to even see the shadows of the clouds. I'm not sure what you're babbling about.

Quote
hanks guys for taking up the argument in my absence.
I have little more to add, but it occurred to me that a this picture with the contrast boosted might prove useful in demonstrating the curvature of the horizon and drop off point under the atmosphere.

Looks like you're adjusting the contrast of the spotlight sun to me.

I believe he is speaking about the shadow on the clouds themselves, not the shadow the clouds are casting on the ground.  I understand that you are trying to be difficult because your theory is falling apart, but come on, playing dumb.......really?  I love it when my students do this.  Its usually the beginning of the end.
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: Tom Bishop on September 22, 2008, 08:24:34 AM
Quote
I believe he is speaking about the shadow on the clouds themselves, not the shadow the clouds are casting on the ground.  I understand that you are trying to be difficult because your theory is falling apart, but come on, playing dumb.......really?  I love it when my students do this.  Its usually the beginning of the end.

The post specifically said the shadows of the clouds, not the shadows on the clouds. It helps to be specific in these matters.

But after going back and looking at the picture again It's clear that the shadows on the clouds wouldn't play much of a difference between FE and RE. In the shot the sun is just to the upper right of the image.
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: ﮎingulaЯiτy on September 22, 2008, 09:06:45 AM
Looks like you're adjusting the contrast of the spotlight sun to me.
Then why does the atmosphere separate from the Earth so cleanly? If you believe that the earth does continue and the is no edge of atmosphere, then why does the earth cut off cleanly twice for one spotlight. I see an edge for earth and for atmosphere followed by space.
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: ghazwozza on September 22, 2008, 09:08:58 AM
Looks like you're adjusting the contrast of the spotlight sun to me.
Then why does the atmosphere separate from the Earth so cleanly? If you believe that the earth does continue and the is no edge of atmosphere, then why does the earth cut off cleanly twice for one spotlight. I see an edge for earth and for atmosphere followed by space.

Also, why is there not a large region of twilight?
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: Tom Bishop on September 22, 2008, 09:19:58 AM
Quote
Then why does the atmosphere separate from the Earth so cleanly? If you believe that the earth does continue and the is no edge of atmosphere, then why does the earth cut off cleanly twice for one spotlight. I see an edge for earth and for atmosphere followed by space.

You're looking at an atmosphere which is backgrounded by gloom and shadow.
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: ghazwozza on September 22, 2008, 09:34:04 AM
Quote
Then why does the atmosphere separate from the Earth so cleanly? If you believe that the earth does continue and the is no edge of atmosphere, then why does the earth cut off cleanly twice for one spotlight. I see an edge for earth and for atmosphere followed by space.

You're looking at an atmosphere which is backgrounded by gloom and shadow.


Where? I see daylight going directly to pitch blackness.
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: John Jackson on September 27, 2008, 04:59:57 PM
Below is a picture I took on my recent trip to Europe. I see a curve, and unless the "ice wall" is in the middle of Northern Canada, then I don't see how this picture could make any sense unless the Earth is round. I made a straight line across the horizon so that you can compare it with the curve. Notice how the curve is easier to see the farther you are from your screen. This is why the Earth looks flat from up close (when you are standing on it).

Here is the picture:
Quote
some obsene picture

All I could see was goatse.
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: ﮎingulaЯiτy on September 29, 2008, 06:00:38 AM
Quote
Then why does the atmosphere separate from the Earth so cleanly? If you believe that the earth does continue and the is no edge of atmosphere, then why does the earth cut off cleanly twice for 'one' spotlight. I see an edge for earth and for atmosphere followed by space.

You're looking at an atmosphere which is backgrounded by gloom and shadow.

Yes, I know your theory. I'm asking how you think it holds based on the observations I listed. Try reading my questions again.
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: MadDogX on September 29, 2008, 06:24:50 AM
The photographs are fake. The students are in league with the lizard army (NASA)

/troll


/spelling nazi
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: MadDogX on September 29, 2008, 06:33:55 AM
The word may exist, but I can find no evidence that the phrase "to be in liege with somebody" is valid.
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: zamadatix on September 29, 2008, 03:38:55 PM
though i may be RE, i disagree. just because somebody said something you can tfind someone else once said doesn't make them wrong.  ;)
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: OompaHolzbach on September 29, 2008, 06:37:57 PM
There certainly is a "curve", but that image is quite frankly innappropriate. This is a family friendly site. Take your smut elsewhere.

The moment I read this, I had to respond.

Mr. Oscar Wilde, you yourself were not an appropriate man and therefore should not be on these forums. I wrote a paper, only 14 pages though, on you and your homosexual beliefs and lifestyles. I realize this really isn't you, as you died a "Catholic" many years ago, but reading this "family freidnyl" quote and then looking at your name created too much irony for me to pass up.
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: Roundy the Truthinessist on September 29, 2008, 06:52:43 PM
There certainly is a "curve", but that image is quite frankly innappropriate. This is a family friendly site. Take your smut elsewhere.

The moment I read this, I had to respond.

Mr. Oscar Wilde, you yourself were not an appropriate man and therefore should not be on these forums. I wrote a paper, only 14 pages though, on you and your homosexual beliefs and lifestyles. I realize this really isn't you, as you died a "Catholic" many years ago, but reading this "family freidnyl" quote and then looking at your name created too much irony for me to pass up.

This is your warning.  Take the trolling elsewhere.
Title: Re: Explain this Picture
Post by: OompaHolzbach on September 29, 2008, 06:58:18 PM
There certainly is a "curve", but that image is quite frankly innappropriate. This is a family friendly site. Take your smut elsewhere.

Mr. Oscar Wilde, you yourself were not an appropriate man and therefore should not be on these forums. I wrote a paper, only 14 pages though, on you and your homosexual beliefs and lifestyles. I realize this really isn't you, as you died a "Catholic" many years ago, but reading this "family freidnyl" quote and then looking at your name created too much irony for me to pass up.

This is your warning.  Take the trolling elsewhere.


I don't find myself trolling anymore than the posts just around 6 above mine.

But, nonetheless I'll stop. My English Literature and historical side got to me, and I can't simply leave an incorrect statement be.

Back to the picture: I agree. I see a curvature, and there's not much to deny it that I've seen as of yet. I will respond again once suitable evidence against the curvature of the horizon of the picture has been presented.