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Lunar Danger! James and Ichi are the only ones?

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jackofhearts

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Re: Lunar Danger! James and Ichi are the only ones?
« Reply #120 on: May 15, 2010, 09:55:13 AM »
Quote from: Johannes on May 14, 2010, 11:12:57 PM
Quote from: jackofhearts on May 14, 2010, 08:17:01 PM
I just wanted to point out that nobody has posted any real evidence that Moonlight is harmful to the human body, which is perhaps one of THE MOST RIDICULOUS things I have ever heard in my life.  What's even funner: that some people here seem to believe it.

So, anyone have any evidence/proof of the harm Moonlight does to oneself?
http://www.theflatearthsociety.org/forum/index.php?topic=34082.0

Well, I took a brief look, and I saw this:
Quote
Most peculiar is that moonlight exposure causes a rise in blood pressure. It is well-known that some of the most accurate BP readings occur right as someone wakes up and at that event, the BP will be shown for the most part to stay lower than that of a daily average. However, this experiment has shown otherwise and has given evidence that the moonlight causes negative effects on organisms. This includes humans. To say otherwise would be silly and a bit foolish considering the supporting data. However, these experiments and peer-reviewed articles mentioned should not be considered as insight to the extent of damage given from moonlight. The main conclusion is that there is a damaging effect that occurs.

The majority of his evidence is on plants and animals.  There are plenty of things that harm plants and animals, but not humans.  As for this evidence in a 'rise in blood pressure', spiked blood pressure cannot be attributed to moonlight exposure.  It can be the result of many things, most notable among them being STRESS.

As far as I'm concerned, your fear of the moonlight may have very well spiked your blood pressure.  The human body's responses to fear and stress are nearly identical; one response is elevated blood pressure.

So as soon as you can eliminate all other variables, or you can come up with a well-documented, long-term study on the risks associated with moonlight exposure, nobody can take your 'research' seriously. 
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Roundy the Truthinessist

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Re: Lunar Danger! James and Ichi are the only ones?
« Reply #121 on: May 15, 2010, 11:17:27 AM »
Quote from: jackofhearts on May 15, 2010, 09:55:13 AM
As for this evidence in a 'rise in blood pressure', spiked blood pressure cannot be attributed to moonlight exposure.

Source?
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Quote from: wise on August 21, 2018, 11:47:45 PM
Where did you educate the biology, in toulet?
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jackofhearts

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Re: Lunar Danger! James and Ichi are the only ones?
« Reply #122 on: May 15, 2010, 11:21:37 AM »
Edit:

Quote
As for this evidence in a 'rise in blood pressure', spiked blood pressure cannot be SOLELY attributed to moonlight exposure.
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Roundy the Truthinessist

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Re: Lunar Danger! James and Ichi are the only ones?
« Reply #123 on: May 15, 2010, 11:25:55 AM »
Quote from: jackofhearts on May 15, 2010, 11:21:37 AM
Edit:

Quote
As for this evidence in a 'rise in blood pressure', spiked blood pressure cannot be SOLELY attributed to moonlight exposure.

Where does the cited article even imply that, and how is it relevant to the discussion?  ???
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Quote from: wise on August 21, 2018, 11:47:45 PM
Where did you educate the biology, in toulet?
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jackofhearts

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Re: Lunar Danger! James and Ichi are the only ones?
« Reply #124 on: May 15, 2010, 11:48:56 AM »
Quote from: Roundy the Truthinessist on May 15, 2010, 11:25:55 AM
Quote from: jackofhearts on May 15, 2010, 11:21:37 AM
Edit:

Quote
As for this evidence in a 'rise in blood pressure', spiked blood pressure cannot be SOLELY attributed to moonlight exposure.

Where does the cited article even imply that, and how is it relevant to the discussion?  ???


Quote
stress can lead to emotional, psychological, and even physical problems -- including heart disease, high blood pressure, chest pains, or irregular heart beats.
http://www.webmd.com/hypertension-high-blood-pressure/guide/hypertension-easing-stress

It's relevant because I'm trying to show you that Ichi's findings can't be taken seriously.
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Lorddave

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Re: Lunar Danger! James and Ichi are the only ones?
« Reply #125 on: May 15, 2010, 11:51:20 AM »
Bloody hell, a slight rise in blood pressure by the person doing the experiment is about as bogus and biased as possible.

Animal Attacks at night are an indirect effect of moonlight and not a direct one.  And as Ichi so notably mentioned, a hydra is frozen, indicating less function in moonlight.  This contradicts the idea that moonlight causes more active and aggressive behavior.
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Quote from: wise on May 26, 2023, 05:06:05 AM
You have been ignored for common interest of mankind.

I am a terrible person and I am a typical Blowhard Liberal for being wrong about Bom.
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Roundy the Truthinessist

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Re: Lunar Danger! James and Ichi are the only ones?
« Reply #126 on: May 15, 2010, 11:57:11 AM »
Quote from: jackofhearts on May 15, 2010, 11:48:56 AM
Quote from: Roundy the Truthinessist on May 15, 2010, 11:25:55 AM
Quote from: jackofhearts on May 15, 2010, 11:21:37 AM
Edit:

Quote
As for this evidence in a 'rise in blood pressure', spiked blood pressure cannot be SOLELY attributed to moonlight exposure.

Where does the cited article even imply that, and how is it relevant to the discussion?  ???


Quote
stress can lead to emotional, psychological, and even physical problems -- including heart disease, high blood pressure, chest pains, or irregular heart beats.
http://www.webmd.com/hypertension-high-blood-pressure/guide/hypertension-easing-stress

Did I, or anyone else, ever argue that stress can't cause a rise in blood pressure?

Quote
It's relevant because I'm trying to show you that Ichi's findings can't be taken seriously.

Then your argument is incredibly faulty.  How does the fact that other things can cause high blood pressure prove that moonlight can't?

 
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Quote from: wise on August 21, 2018, 11:47:45 PM
Where did you educate the biology, in toulet?
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jackofhearts

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Re: Lunar Danger! James and Ichi are the only ones?
« Reply #127 on: May 15, 2010, 12:04:40 PM »
Had you actually read what I wrote, I said that the fact that many other things could've caused his raise in blood pressure mean that he cannot argue moonlight raised his blood pressure. 

If you had red my quote from Ichi's first post:

Quote
Most peculiar is that moonlight exposure causes a rise in blood pressure. It is well-known that some of the most accurate BP readings occur right as someone wakes up and at that event, the BP will be shown for the most part to stay lower than that of a daily average. However, this experiment has shown otherwise and has given evidence that the moonlight causes negative effects on organisms. This includes humans. To say otherwise would be silly and a bit foolish considering the supporting data. However, these experiments and peer-reviewed articles mentioned should not be considered as insight to the extent of damage given from moonlight. The main conclusion is that there is a damaging effect that occurs.

You'd have realized that 'high blood pressure' is the only negative result he observed in humans.  All of his findings on other animals and plants are completely irrelevant, regardless of their truth value; humans are not the same as plants or animals.  Therefore, the majority of his argument is irrelevant anyway.

Bottom line is, moonlight is perfectly fine for a human being. 
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Roundy the Truthinessist

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Re: Lunar Danger! James and Ichi are the only ones?
« Reply #128 on: May 15, 2010, 12:27:30 PM »
Quote from: jackofhearts on May 15, 2010, 12:04:40 PM
You'd have realized that 'high blood pressure' is the only negative result he observed in humans.  All of his findings on other animals and plants are completely irrelevant, regardless of their truth value; humans are not the same as plants or animals.  Therefore, the majority of his argument is irrelevant anyway.

Sure you agree that the correlation is significant.  There's no reason to dismiss Ichy's findings out of hand because of the off chance that there might be another cause for his spike in blood pressure, especially given the known negative effect moonlight is found to have in organisms.  I'm sure Ichy considers his experiments in this area to be an ongoing process.

Quote
Bottom line is, moonlight is perfectly fine for a human being. 

Bottom line is, you have yet to support this claptrap.
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Quote from: wise on August 21, 2018, 11:47:45 PM
Where did you educate the biology, in toulet?
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jackofhearts

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Re: Lunar Danger! James and Ichi are the only ones?
« Reply #129 on: May 15, 2010, 12:41:11 PM »
Quote
because of the off chance that there might be another cause for his spike in blood pressure

Are you really that thickheaded?  You speak as if you think "stress = high blood pressure" is outlandish as I think "moonlight = bad" is.  Are you seriously assuming that his high blood pressure (which isn't even significantly higher than it was when he wasn't exposed to moonlight) can be attributed to "moonlight"?  If moonlight was dangerous, I would know about it.  There are, however, tangible links between stress and high blood pressure, as opposed to a questionable, small-scale observation by a person who may or may not be sane.

Also, once again, all his other findings in plants and other animals must be dismissed and cannot further be used in this argument.  Did you know that chocolate is poisonous to dogs?  Well it sure as hell isn't to humans.  You absolutely cannot simply assume that, because moonlight *may* have had a *slight* negative effect on *SOME* plants and animals, it's the same for humans.  That would just be ignorant.
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Roundy the Truthinessist

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Re: Lunar Danger! James and Ichi are the only ones?
« Reply #130 on: May 15, 2010, 12:47:01 PM »
Quote from: jackofhearts on May 15, 2010, 12:41:11 PM
Quote
because of the off chance that there might be another cause for his spike in blood pressure

Are you really that thickheaded?  You speak as if you think "stress = high blood pressure" is outlandish as I think "moonlight = bad" is.

No, I don't.  If you're going to try to seriously debate on a forum you might want to look into reading comprehension.

Quote
Are you seriously assuming that his high blood pressure (which isn't even significantly higher than it was when he wasn't exposed to moonlight) can be attributed to "moonlight"?

I'm assuming nothing, my position is purely based on the experimental evidence.

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If moonlight was dangerous, I would know about it.

How?  Scientists are discovering new dangers in things we take for granted every day (and night!) all the time.

Quote
There are, however, tangible links between stress and high blood pressure, as opposed to a questionable, small-scale observation by a person who may or may not be sane.

Once again, I never argued that there's no link between stress and high blood pressure.



Quote
Also, once again, all his other findings in plants and other animals must be dismissed and cannot further be used in this argument.  Did you know that chocolate is poisonous to dogs?  Well it sure as hell isn't to humans.  You absolutely cannot simply assume that, because moonlight *may* have had a *slight* negative effect on *SOME* plants and animals, it's the same for humans.  That would just be ignorant.

Nobody is assuming anything here, except maybe for you.
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Quote from: wise on August 21, 2018, 11:47:45 PM
Where did you educate the biology, in toulet?
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Username

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Re: Lunar Danger! James and Ichi are the only ones?
« Reply #131 on: May 15, 2010, 12:48:05 PM »
I don't see how anyone is really questioning this hard scientific fact.  The moon is clearly dangerous - however how dangerous is the question and how can we protect ourselves.
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The Terror

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Re: Lunar Danger! James and Ichi are the only ones?
« Reply #132 on: May 15, 2010, 12:51:29 PM »
Quote from: jackofhearts on May 15, 2010, 12:41:11 PM
Also, once again, all his other findings in plants and other animals must be dismissed and cannot further be used in this argument.  Did you know that chocolate is poisonous to dogs?  Well it sure as hell isn't to humans. 

Chocolate is poisonous to humans
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Lord Wilmore

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Re: Lunar Danger! James and Ichi are the only ones?
« Reply #133 on: May 15, 2010, 12:53:44 PM »
Quote from: Thermal Detonator on May 15, 2010, 08:03:33 AM
Quote from: Lord Wilmore on May 15, 2010, 06:14:41 AM
I find it quite amusing that you expect everyone else to prove in detail why you are wrong, but are satisfied to give a simple 'no' to support your own arguments.

A simple "no" is quite sufficient as a summary of a thread which has had at least two spin off threads discussing the validity of its results, don't you think? Or would you prefer I started going over old ground?


Ideally, you'd cover new, relevant and well argued ground, in contrast with your previous efforts.
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Space Tourist

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Re: Lunar Danger! James and Ichi are the only ones?
« Reply #134 on: May 15, 2010, 12:54:12 PM »
Quote from: The Terror on May 15, 2010, 12:51:29 PM
Quote from: jackofhearts on May 15, 2010, 12:41:11 PM
Also, once again, all his other findings in plants and other animals must be dismissed and cannot further be used in this argument.  Did you know that chocolate is poisonous to dogs?  Well it sure as hell isn't to humans. 

Chocolate is poisonous to humans

So is dihydrogen monoxide  ::)
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Quote from: Parsifal on May 14, 2010, 02:21:28 AM
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markjo

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Re: Lunar Danger! James and Ichi are the only ones?
« Reply #135 on: May 15, 2010, 12:55:08 PM »
Quote from: Roundy the Truthinessist on May 15, 2010, 12:27:30 PM
There's no reason to dismiss Ichy's findings out of hand because of the off chance that there might be another cause for his spike in blood pressure...

Funny, that's pretty much the same reason you give when you dismiss photographs from space.
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Roundy the Truthinessist

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Re: Lunar Danger! James and Ichi are the only ones?
« Reply #136 on: May 15, 2010, 12:56:21 PM »
Quote from: markjo on May 15, 2010, 12:55:08 PM
Quote from: Roundy the Truthinessist on May 15, 2010, 12:27:30 PM
There's no reason to dismiss Ichy's findings out of hand because of the off chance that there might be another cause for his spike in blood pressure...

Funny, that's pretty much the same reason you give when you dismiss photographs from space.

At least Ichy's experiments are repeatable and verifiable.  ::)
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Quote from: wise on August 21, 2018, 11:47:45 PM
Where did you educate the biology, in toulet?
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The Terror

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Re: Lunar Danger! James and Ichi are the only ones?
« Reply #137 on: May 15, 2010, 12:56:53 PM »
Quote from: Space Tourist on May 15, 2010, 12:54:12 PM
Quote from: The Terror on May 15, 2010, 12:51:29 PM
Quote from: jackofhearts on May 15, 2010, 12:41:11 PM
Also, once again, all his other findings in plants and other animals must be dismissed and cannot further be used in this argument.  Did you know that chocolate is poisonous to dogs?  Well it sure as hell isn't to humans. 

Chocolate is poisonous to humans

So is dihydrogen monoxide  ::)

Mock all you want, but when you die of chocolate poisoning I will have the last laugh!
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Space Tourist

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Re: Lunar Danger! James and Ichi are the only ones?
« Reply #138 on: May 15, 2010, 01:01:04 PM »
Quote from: The Terror on May 15, 2010, 12:56:53 PM
Quote from: Space Tourist on May 15, 2010, 12:54:12 PM
Quote from: The Terror on May 15, 2010, 12:51:29 PM
Quote from: jackofhearts on May 15, 2010, 12:41:11 PM
Also, once again, all his other findings in plants and other animals must be dismissed and cannot further be used in this argument.  Did you know that chocolate is poisonous to dogs?  Well it sure as hell isn't to humans.  

Chocolate is poisonous to humans

So is dihydrogen monoxide  ::)

Mock all you want, but when you die of chocolate poisoning I will have the last laugh!
hey now 100's of people die from dihydrogen monoxide every year
http://www.dhmo.org/facts.html
« Last Edit: May 15, 2010, 01:05:12 PM by Space Tourist »
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Quote from: Parsifal on May 14, 2010, 02:21:28 AM
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markjo

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Re: Lunar Danger! James and Ichi are the only ones?
« Reply #139 on: May 15, 2010, 01:07:36 PM »
Quote from: Roundy the Truthinessist on May 15, 2010, 12:56:21 PM
Quote from: markjo on May 15, 2010, 12:55:08 PM
Quote from: Roundy the Truthinessist on May 15, 2010, 12:27:30 PM
There's no reason to dismiss Ichy's findings out of hand because of the off chance that there might be another cause for his spike in blood pressure...

Funny, that's pretty much the same reason you give when you dismiss photographs from space.

At least Ichy's experiments are repeatable and verifiable.  ::)

And so are photographs from space. 
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Roundy the Truthinessist

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Re: Lunar Danger! James and Ichi are the only ones?
« Reply #140 on: May 15, 2010, 01:10:16 PM »
Quote from: markjo on May 15, 2010, 01:07:36 PM
Quote from: Roundy the Truthinessist on May 15, 2010, 12:56:21 PM
Quote from: markjo on May 15, 2010, 12:55:08 PM
Quote from: Roundy the Truthinessist on May 15, 2010, 12:27:30 PM
There's no reason to dismiss Ichy's findings out of hand because of the off chance that there might be another cause for his spike in blood pressure...

Funny, that's pretty much the same reason you give when you dismiss photographs from space.

At least Ichy's experiments are repeatable and verifiable.  ::)

And so are photographs from space. 

Yes, for an extremely select few!  Besides, I don't dispute that the flat surface of the Earth might appear round from extremely high altitudes.  I just don't think it proves anything.
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Quote from: wise on August 21, 2018, 11:47:45 PM
Where did you educate the biology, in toulet?
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jackofhearts

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Re: Lunar Danger! James and Ichi are the only ones?
« Reply #141 on: May 15, 2010, 01:11:23 PM »
Quote from: John Davis on May 15, 2010, 12:48:05 PM
I don't see how anyone is really questioning this hard scientific fact.  The moon is clearly dangerous - however how dangerous is the question and how can we protect ourselves.

Hard scientific fact?  Nobody has given me a single piece of solid evidence to support this claim.  Could you give me some links, evidence, anything?  You can't go around saying crap like that without backing it up in some way.  Imagine how you'd react if I went around saying, "I can't believe anyone is even on this website anyway.  It's a hard, scientific fact that the Earth is round."

Also, Terror, stop trolling.  Chocolate is most certainly not poisonous to humans.

Finally, Roundy, I know you never questioned the link betweeen stress and HBP.  My point was, none of Ichi's findings are valid, because there are too many other explanations for his results.

Also, noobody’s assuming anything?...

Quote
especially given the known negative effect moonlight is found to have in organisms

You just ASSUMED that, because moonlight is apparently known to have a negative affect on organisms, that it’s harmful to humans.

And I’m pretty confident my reading comprehension is just fine.
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Ichimaru Gin :]

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Re: Lunar Danger! James and Ichi are the only ones?
« Reply #142 on: May 15, 2010, 01:14:29 PM »
Quote from: jackofhearts on May 15, 2010, 01:11:23 PM
Quote from: John Davis on May 15, 2010, 12:48:05 PM
I don't see how anyone is really questioning this hard scientific fact.  The moon is clearly dangerous - however how dangerous is the question and how can we protect ourselves.
Quote
especially given the known negative effect moonlight is found to have in organisms

You just ASSUMED that, because moonlight is apparently known to have a negative affect on organisms, that it’s harmful to humans.
Most people would agree that humans are organisms.
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Quote from: James on August 26, 2011, 05:40:53 AM
I saw a slight haze in the hotel bathroom this morning after I took a shower, have I discovered a new planet?
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Roundy the Truthinessist

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Re: Lunar Danger! James and Ichi are the only ones?
« Reply #143 on: May 15, 2010, 01:16:34 PM »
Quote from: jackofhearts on May 15, 2010, 01:11:23 PM
Quote
especially given the known negative effect moonlight is found to have in organisms

You just ASSUMED that, because moonlight is apparently known to have a negative affect on organisms, that it’s harmful to humans.

Jesus Christ, here's a link.

www.rif.org
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Quote from: wise on August 21, 2018, 11:47:45 PM
Where did you educate the biology, in toulet?
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jackofhearts

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Re: Lunar Danger! James and Ichi are the only ones?
« Reply #144 on: May 15, 2010, 01:24:15 PM »
Quote
Mos tpeople would agree that humans are organisms.

No shit we're organims.  My problem is, the only evidence you gave for negative effects to humans was 'elevated blood pressure'.  Everything you pointed out concerned other organisms.

And that was really mature, Roundy.  How about you actually read what I read and respond?  Or did you finally realize how absurd this thread really is?
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Ichimaru Gin :]

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Re: Lunar Danger! James and Ichi are the only ones?
« Reply #145 on: May 15, 2010, 01:25:27 PM »
read Levee's additions concerning human effects. Also, others posted links of effects documented by older FE advocates.
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Quote from: James on August 26, 2011, 05:40:53 AM
I saw a slight haze in the hotel bathroom this morning after I took a shower, have I discovered a new planet?
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jackofhearts

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Re: Lunar Danger! James and Ichi are the only ones?
« Reply #146 on: May 15, 2010, 01:26:43 PM »
Quote from: Ichimaru Gin :] on May 15, 2010, 01:25:27 PM
read Levee's additions concerning human effects. Also, others posted links of effects documented by older FE advocates.

Links?
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Ichimaru Gin :]

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Re: Lunar Danger! James and Ichi are the only ones?
« Reply #147 on: May 15, 2010, 01:27:52 PM »
I believe same thread.
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Quote from: James on August 26, 2011, 05:40:53 AM
I saw a slight haze in the hotel bathroom this morning after I took a shower, have I discovered a new planet?
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jackofhearts

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Re: Lunar Danger! James and Ichi are the only ones?
« Reply #148 on: May 15, 2010, 01:36:24 PM »
The only link was to this:

http://www.theflatearthsociety.org/forum/index.php?topic=34082.0

And once again, the only attempts you made at prooving the harmful effects of moonlights are these:

- May be harmful to other organisms

- Appears to elevate blood pressure in humans

Neither of this are proof or evidence at all, for reasons I've already stated.
Anything else?
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Ichimaru Gin :]

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Re: Lunar Danger! James and Ichi are the only ones?
« Reply #149 on: May 15, 2010, 01:38:15 PM »
Quote from: Ichimaru Gin :] on May 15, 2010, 01:25:27 PM
read Levee's additions concerning human effects. Also, others posted links of effects documented by older FE advocates.
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Quote from: James on August 26, 2011, 05:40:53 AM
I saw a slight haze in the hotel bathroom this morning after I took a shower, have I discovered a new planet?
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